Consequences of scrapping section 21 etc

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    Consequences of scrapping section 21 etc

    The Antis claim scrapping section 21 has "worked" in Scotland. It hasn't, it just takes a long time for the consequences to filter through;

    The Scottish Association of Landlords (SAL) says their members are reporting drops of 80% or more in the number of properties available to let...

    SAL says the shortage is caused by landlords choosing to exit the sector over the past few years because of the threat of disproportionate regulation...

    “We are just beginning to see some of the consequences of the hostile anti-landlord rhetoric from the Scottish Government as landlords leave the sector ..."

    #2
    Not quite sure what else they expected. If you provide a free pass to shoplifters, charge shops massive rates and skew the tax system to make retail outlets more expensive to run than Amazon -- you get less retail shopping facilities for the population. That is what happened. You can blame it on Covid and our supposed general disinclination to leave our computer screens but the incentives within the system are far more subtle.

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      #3
      The possible removal of the S21 in England will not in itself cause me to exit (that is the EPC C) but it simply adds to the overall reason why i am pulling out around 2026. It is simply getting all too much and i am of the age where i cannot be bothered.

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        #4
        Originally posted by Hudson01 View Post
        The possible removal of the S21 in England will not in itself cause me to exit (that is the EPC C) but it simply adds to the overall reason why i am pulling out around 2026. It is simply getting all too much and i am of the age where i cannot be bothered.
        Problem is, I can see our spiteful government making a property have to be a C to sell, as well as to rent. Then we really will be stuck.
        To save them chiming in, JPKeates, Theartfullodger, Boletus, Mindthegap, Macromia, Holy Cow & Ted.E.Bear think the opposite of me on almost every subject.

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          #5
          Originally posted by boletus View Post
          The Antis claim scrapping section 21 has "worked" in Scotland. It hasn't, it just takes a long time for the consequences to filter through
          Do you think that landlords don't evict their current tenants when the ban starts, they just don't renew when their tenants move out?

          That's where I am with the proposed change, and it's why I'm more concerned about the EPC change.
          That kills my business stone dead.

          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

          Comment


            #6
            The bigger problem is that there is a large pool of floating voters who like and want what the Tories should be doing, but are not doing. They (both landlords and tenants) don't want the private rental sector to be hammered, they don't want wealth taxes, they don't want money wasted on corrupt schemes and on people who have never contributed to the UK economy, they want a safety net for the very vulnerable whilst not providing to scroungers and crooks. They want that people who have always lived here and have paid taxes can still get dental care, hearing aids and good basic medical care.

            They definitely don't want what the opposition is offering which is basically worse.

            The risk is that if the Tories don't get their act together - and do what they were elected to do - they will be voted out and we will all be down the proverbial toilet as a Starmer government transitions into a Corbynite loonie-bag.

            I don't think they are "spiteful" - just really really dumb.

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              #7
              Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
              That kills my business stone dead.
              The EPC thing won't just kill your business - it is hard to map out any scenario where it won't be the trigger that sends the entire UK economy over a cliff.

              But I'm not sure politicians even try to risk assess scenarios - in the way that even the worst construction project manager would do for a building site. We have buzzwords and buzzing ideas, but no logical thinking at all. Even a back of an envelope sketch would predict disaster here (with the EPC scenario, but also S21 England wide). Not sure that most English people want the fundamental mess that is Scotland.

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                #8

                S21 in itself isn't the issue - we would all prefer longer term Tenants after all.

                The problem is - as always - the lousy Tenants, and the fairest way to abolish S21 is to have a fast, efficient, effective, cost-free S8 process.

                You shouldn't implement one without the other up and running in tandem.

                Ah, dreaming again.
                My views are my own - you may not agree with them. I tend say things as I see them and I don't do "political correctness". Just because we may not agree you can still buy me a pint lol

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by landlord-man View Post
                  The problem is - as always - the lousy Tenants, and the fairest way to abolish S21 is to have a fast, efficient, effective, cost-free S8 process.
                  The changes in Scotland increased the scope of their equivalent of section 8 and made it much easier for a tenant to give notice.

                  When the Department of Justice publishes its statistics next month, it will be interesting to see where the court and eviction timescales are compared to 2019.

                  When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                  Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by landlord-man View Post
                    S21 in itself isn't the issue - we would all prefer longer term Tenants after all.
                    Not really

                    That's the problem -- we imagine (and the politicians imagine) a rental market that consists of the sort of tenant sitting in a Shelter waiting room or in a Job Centre. That is not what it is. Almost all my tenants are
                    - Wealthy
                    - Want high end furnished property
                    - Never want to stay longer than 18 months or two years, often only 6 months
                    - They are renting because (for what they want and need) renting is cheaper, nicer, less hassle, comfortable and risk free

                    The people the economy needs to keep powered don't want what the government are trying to drive the market towards (sh_t properties at a high rate of rent, red tape costs, with nothing special, and managed and owned by some faceless offshore corporation or estate agent -- sort of like a shorter term leasehold)

                    Comment


                      #11
                      That's not really what I said (or what I meant anyway lol)

                      We ALL want decent Tenants who stay a long time IF THEY WANT TO.

                      How many LLs actually want 6 x 6-month Tenants in 3 years - we'd all prefer 1 decent Tenant staying for those 3 years.

                      So getting rid of S21 will give renters the confidence and reassurance they want.

                      Sadly, unless the evictions element is massively changed, for crappy Tenants it will be like winning the Lottery (which they'd still hide lol)
                      My views are my own - you may not agree with them. I tend say things as I see them and I don't do "political correctness". Just because we may not agree you can still buy me a pint lol

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by JK0 View Post

                        Problem is, I can see our spiteful government making a property have to be a C to sell, as well as to rent. Then we really will be stuck.
                        I had thought exactly the same, so will be keeping a very keen eye on what is about to go through the house of fun (Parliament), the moment i get a sniff of this becoming possible the S21 is on the mat for my tenants and i am out. They would never be able to bring this in for owner/occupiers as no govt would survive it, but for landlords...... most certainly.

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                          #13
                          BTW, guys, are you aware that the measurements contributing to the EPC score have been tightened? If any of you had a property assessed about ten years ago, go and get a new EPC, and I bet you it's at least ten points lower.

                          Also, I have noticed that certain improvements suggested have far less benefit if mentioned on a 2021 EPC than on a 2010 EPC. Seems to be shenanigans going on, to constantly drive improvements.
                          To save them chiming in, JPKeates, Theartfullodger, Boletus, Mindthegap, Macromia, Holy Cow & Ted.E.Bear think the opposite of me on almost every subject.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Jko so it sounds as if a typical victorian terraced house will fail to get the epc
                            c ?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Codger View Post
                              Jko so it sounds as if a typical victorian terraced house will fail to get the epc
                              c ?
                              Mine got a D from a very friendly assessor in 2019. I think I would not mind making improvements if you knew that was going to be the end of it. Having the standards continually hiked takes all the pleasure out of life. I think mine will be sold to a developer to convert to flats when C arrives, as there is no EPC requirement for a place being converted.
                              To save them chiming in, JPKeates, Theartfullodger, Boletus, Mindthegap, Macromia, Holy Cow & Ted.E.Bear think the opposite of me on almost every subject.

                              Comment

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