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    When someone says "We had an advisory referendum" they have already lost the argument
    Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

    Comment


      Originally posted by Macromia View Post
      [/LIST]The result HAS been acted upon.
      Even if we eventually end up remaining in the EU (which I think is unfortunately unlikely), it is a blatant, outright lie to claim that the result of the referendum has not been acted upon.
      I acknowledge that a lot of work has been done by the government to find a Brexit solution agreeable with the EU and I initially congratulated Mrs May on coming up with some sort of a deal. I just wish Parliament could for once put aside their selfish party interests and work together in unison to find the best solution for the whole country. Sadly though it seems there are a lot of MPs are more concerned about their own political careers than what is right for the country.

      Comment


        I think the biggest issue they have come across, is maybe leaving the EU is not the best solution and what is right for the country is the status quo.

        I appears that all research done states that no matter what type of Brexit we have, it will negatively affect the country. This is research done by both sides of the argument. So what you have is politicians trying to argue whether we should make things worse, or makes things even more worse.

        We all got sold a boogie man. Constant messages about how the EU was our enemy in order to cover up our own failings. We don't want to think we fail at anything, we are Great Britain, We conquered the world, we rule the waves, nothing can keep us down. So when things went wrong in our country, we pointed the finger overseas and said its all their fault and we as a country believed them. Trace it back and you see that we are the masters of our own demise, not Johnny foreigner.

        I expect that even if we leave, and our economy takes a hit, that we can still get a few more years of blaming others before it might finally hit home. But after all that, they may move onto someone else to blame. And we as a country will follow blindly like sheep and agree with them once again.

        Comment


          Leaving with No Deal or with a withdrawal arrangement (Theresa May's or the current "deal") doesn't end anything. We then have to start the actual trade deal with the EU - because it's our biggest trading partner it needs to be done as a priority.

          This is from The Times this morrning..

          "Before us stretch long months of detailed and tortuous negotiations on our future trade relationship with the EU. Many simply do not realise this next chapter exists. Lord Cooper of Windrush, the founder of the pollsters Populus, who holds regular focus groups on Brexit, has spoken of a “crucial misunderstanding among many voters, who assume that the ‘deal’ over which MPs are bickering covers not only the terms by which we leave the EU but also the details of our trading relationship after we’ve left”. When these focus groups are told that Brexit triggers a longer phase of talks and trade negotiations, the response is often “horrified silence”.
          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

          Comment


            No silence over here! Bring it on!
            Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

            Comment


              THE TRUTH ABOUT YOU BEING REPLACED, and having to support 3rd world unskilled people in their millions in the U.K.

              On Dec 18th,2018, Traitorous May Went to Moroco and signed the U.N.

              GLOBAL COMPACT FOR SAFE, ORDERLY AND REGULAR IMMIGRATION PACT.

              It will also make it a CRIMINAL OFFENCE to criticise the government Forced and REGULAR immigration of any one who wants to come here.
              The estimate is approx 50 million people, who can if they want, come here to U.K.. No skills needed.
              AND we HAVE to assist them. Plane fares, accommodation for years, cos they won't have a job to come to !


              shithole5.jpg

              See the video below --- O.K.it's Ireland, but they are staying in the E.U. God help them..

              1:04 to 3:04 is disturbing


              ..

              Comment


                The Global Compact for Migration doesn't make anything a criminal offence in the UK and can't possibly do that - it would require an act of parliament to create a criminal offence.
                When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                Comment


                  Originally posted by islandgirl View Post
                  When someone says "We had an advisory referendum" they have already lost the argument
                  Although you don't like it, is a fact that the 2016 referendum, like almost all referendums in the UK, was advisory.
                  If the referendum hadn't been advisory, there would not still be any argument as to whether or not politicians should be supporting leaving the EU on the basis of the result of that referendum - because it would have been ruled legally void.

                  If you think that stating easily verifiable facts 'loses' an argument, you are basically admitting that YOU don't know what you are talking about and don't have an argument. You cannot reject facts simply because you don't like them.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by kennyj52 View Post
                    Sadly though it seems there are a lot of MPs are more concerned about their own political careers than what is right for the country.
                    This pretty much hits the nail on the head.
                    I think that, if polls of Conservative party members hadn't shown that most members think that holding another referendum, or not going ahead with Brexit, would pretty much mean the end of the Conservative party, and that members would apparently prefer to see the UK break up, and/or the economy of the UK suffer, rather than have Brexit not go ahead, parliament would by now be debating revoking Article 50 (or at least agreeing another referendum to see if 'the people' might favour that).

                    Brexit has always been more about many MP's doing what they thing benefits themselves rather than what is best for the country as a whole.





                    Originally posted by ExpertInAField View Post
                    I think the biggest issue they have come across, is maybe leaving the EU is not the best solution and what is right for the country is the status quo.
                    Originally posted by ExpertInAField View Post
                    I expect that even if we leave, and our economy takes a hit, that we can still get a few more years of blaming others before it might finally hit home. But after all that, they may move onto someone else to blame. And we as a country will follow blindly like sheep and agree with them once again.
                    This is exactly what the situation is.
                    If leaving the EU really was in the best interest of the UK, we would have been seeing convincing arguments about why we should leave, and would have been seeing these from before the referendum was even announced.

                    Instead, what we are currently seeing, is nothing at all about how leaving the EU will benefit the UK (or at best claims that are made without any supporting evidence, or even against the evidence), and instead we are seeing attempts to attribute the blame:
                    "The EU won't give us a good deal."
                    "Remainer MPs and other remain campaigners are to blame for any negative effects that have been experienced because they are only due to the uncertainty."
                    etc., etc.

                    If there were good arguments as to why the UK should leave the EU, leavers would make them and the vast majority of the people in the UK would then accept leaving the EU.

                    So I'll ask again:
                    ​​​​​​​How will the UK benefit from leaving the EU?

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by ram View Post
                      [SIZE=14px]THE TRUTH ABOUT YOU BEING REPLACED, and having to support 3rd world unskilled people in their millions in the U.K.

                      On Dec 18th,2018, Traitorous May Went to Moroco and signed the U.N...
                      The countries being referred to as 'their world countries' here are NOT countries in the EU, and the UN is NOT the EU.

                      Regardless of whether or not Theresa May was right to sign the UK up to this pact - it has nothing at all to do with the EU.

                      This is a rant that has no relevance to Brexit, ram, and does nothing more that demonstrate how xenophobic you are.

                      As jpkeates has pointed out, this pact doesn't make anything a criminal offence in the UK.
                      It should also be pointed out that many of the other issues that you raise in the post are a direct consequence of UK law (and could easily be changed by parliament). Currently, asylum seekers are, more often than not, not allowed to seek employment. If they are not to be kept in some sort of detention centre while their asylum claims are assessed, the law should require them to seek employment while they are waiting to hear whether asylum will be granted. Parliament can change this.


                      P.S. The video by 'Computing Forever' is propaganda.
                      He is one of many YouTubers who doesn't worry about sticking to the facts when making statements that twist, or even contradict, the facts makes it easier to make the argument that he wants (his anti climate change action videos are very good examples of this).

                      Comment


                        "Although you don't like it, is a fact that the 2016 referendum, like almost all referendums in the UK, was advisory." When you are in a hole.....
                        Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

                        Comment


                          Just get remain done...
                          I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                            The Global Compact for Migration doesn't make anything a criminal offence in the UK and can't possibly do that - it would require an act of parliament to create a criminal offence.
                            You get taken to court in U.K.for calling some one a Nazi

                            "May" signed the pact, and not one of the U.K. citizens were asked if they want to financially support 3rd world unskilled people, apart from having no where to put them, and our homeless are still homeless.
                            If they "were" asked, they would say No., but remainers are happy with millions coming to U.K. - and come they will if we stay in the E.U.

                            But all we hear is "It's propaganda"
                            .

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by ram View Post
                              ....If they "were" asked, they would say No., but remainers are happy with millions coming to U.K. - and come they will if we stay in the E.U.............
                              "The Times" today...

                              https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/n...away-ctsdvtbsw

                              Farmers are being forced to leave millions of apples, and many other fruits and vegetables, rotting in orchards and fields because of a shortage of workers.

                              One hundred tonnes of fruit has gone unpicked in Britain already this season, meaning more than 16 million apples so far have been left to rot at the peak of harvest season due to a Brexit-led employment slump.

                              EU workers, who make up a reported 99 per cent of the seasonal picking workforce, are increasingly choosing to work in countries such as the Netherlands, Denmark or Germany because of the weakening of the pound and confusion over visa regulations.

                              I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Macromia View Post
                                So I'll ask again:
                                ​​​​​​​How will the UK benefit from leaving the EU?
                                "EU immigration has continued to fall since 2016 and is at its lowest level since 2013. This is mainly because of a fall in immigration for work, which is now less than half the level it was at its peak in the year ending June 2016." Office for National Statistics

                                That's a major benefit if ever I saw one!

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