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    Originally posted by islandgirl View Post
    JP you hit the nail on the head "b) they have no idea what the supply situation will be post "hard" brexit," These are not facts. They are biased guesses. No worries up here folks!

    If I have cancer (unlikely but waiting for the pathology report to confirm) the radio isotopes that might be needed for treatment can not be stockpiled. There are a fair number of people who need medication to stay alive, hopefully I will not be one of them. Still pretty crass to say "no worries up here folks" when there will be plenty of people "up there" who are rightfully worried. I expect the government to prioritise human medication - but given its incompetence there is plenty of reason for a lot of people to be worried.

    No-one involved with actually bringing supplies of food or medication into the country is saying it will be fine.There will be supply issues that can be mitigated to some extent, the question is over how much that mitigation can work. Exporting will be difficult for other reasons - I'm not stockpiling meat because there are probably going to be a lot of animals slaughtered,

    The pound has fallen, food will be more expensive. the governments own, redacted, document admits there will be electricity price rises. I am confident I can cope with it - but that doesnt mean I ignore the impact on others.

    These are not "biased guesses" - people make estimates based on facts, then try to work out what to do to reduce the impact. Unfortunately not all problems have good solutions.

    What are we supposed to get that makes this worthwhile?



    Comment


      No I reject your rather crass "crass" accusation. If you think noone is saying it will be fine then you don't read outside the remainer press/websites/organisations. Mind you mass slaughter of livestock is a farily new one on me so well done! Incidentally I sincerely hope your tests come back with the best of possible results - good luck.
      Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

      Comment


        The Slog was rather good tonight:
         It may be time for the Brexit debate to be dumped in favour of more important plans to stop the drift towards a technocratic European Reich. In this first of a Slog two-parter, we examine the real history of multidimensional Brexit sabotage, the slim chances of Sovereign Brexit being achieved, and how the Resistance could…

        Comment


          Originally posted by islandgirl View Post
          No I reject your rather crass "crass" accusation. If you think noone is saying it will be fine then you don't read outside the remainer press/websites/organisations. Mind you mass slaughter of livestock is a farily new one on me so well done! Incidentally I sincerely hope your tests come back with the best of possible results - good luck.
          Still haven't heard one benefit of leaving - because no-one wants to admit it's evading tax dodging laws, getting rid of any protections for the workforce and consumers and lining the pockets of hedge funds. But by all means point me to some of these sources that give rational arguments for why everything will be fine. Statements of belief with no justification (what we get from you and the sources you are unwilling to quote because they are such junk) are not convincing.

          If you havent heard about mass slaughter you clearly dont know any farmers and have not read the governments plans. https://www.adas.uk/News/no-deal-brexit

          Comment


            Originally posted by JK0 View Post
            The Slog was rather good tonight:
            Taking that to be one of the "everything will be fine" sources I've read a lot of his posts. Unfortunately while the analysis of the problems may be worth reading there is nothing there that constitutes even the beginning of a plan for how things will improve post Brexit in terms of food sustainability or producing any of the goods we actually need to survive.

            Still waiting for anyone to say how that is going to improve post Brexit.

            I would join the beleevers if any of them had a decent plan - they dont.

            Comment


              "If you havent heard about mass slaughter you clearly dont know any farmers" Sorry Buzzard we ARE farmers.
              Bless you and your demands. It is all out there. Too busy earning a living to open your eyes for you.
              Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

              Comment


                Originally posted by JK0 View Post
                The Slog was rather good tonight:
                It is excellent thank you JKO. The subject wasn't Project Fear Buzzard - could that be why there was no mention of how all will be fine, as it will.
                Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

                Comment


                  One of my family members is undergoing radiotherapy.

                  People with courses of treatment that continue after 31st October that involve radiotherapy are being told that their appointments may be changed or cancelled at short notice because of concerns about the supply of radioactive materials.

                  This is partially because of the risk of travel delays and partially because we lease Euratom at the same time as the EU and that means that there is no internationally recognised supervisory body for radio active materials, which is a pre-condition of shipping medical isotopes to the UK.

                  Which is a bit crap, because the routine and regular nature of the treatment is one of the things that's necessary for it to be effective.
                  When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                  Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                    One of my family members is undergoing radiotherapy.

                    People with courses of treatment that continue after 31st October that involve radiotherapy are being told that their appointments may be changed or cancelled at short notice because of concerns about the supply of radioactive materials.

                    This is partially because of the risk of travel delays and partially because we lease Euratom at the same time as the EU and that means that there is no internationally recognised supervisory body for radio active materials, which is a pre-condition of shipping medical isotopes to the UK.

                    Which is a bit crap, because the routine and regular nature of the treatment is one of the things that's necessary for it to be effective.
                    It is not entirely true that we cannot source this material from outside the EU, we do not need to be members of Euratom. However, I agree travel delays could have an effect.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Kape65 View Post
                      It is not entirely true that we cannot source this material from outside the EU, we do not need to be members of Euratom. However, I agree travel delays could have an effect.
                      My limited understanding is that nations are not supposed to supply radioactive materials to other countries that are outside the umbrella of a recognised supervisory body, because that body is part of the network of trust that means the goods will be properly handled and controlled.

                      For the same reason, no one should accept radio active materials from the UK either.

                      The UK would have to set up its own version of Euratom and the other international agencies would have to recognise it.

                      No one knows what will actually happen, because no one's ever been daft enough to find itself in this situation, except when a new nation is created.
                      When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                      Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                        My limited understanding is that nations are not supposed to supply radioactive materials to other countries that are outside the umbrella of a recognised supervisory body, because that body is part of the network of trust that means the goods will be properly handled and controlled.

                        For the same reason, no one should accept radio active materials from the UK either.

                        The UK would have to set up its own version of Euratom and the other international agencies would have to recognise it.

                        No one knows what will actually happen, because no one's ever been daft enough to find itself in this situation, except when a new nation is created.
                        So JP what do you blame? The fact of possible Brexit, or the fact that conniving folk have been spending all of their time for more than three years resisting and confounding the necessary preparations, throwing as many spanners into the works as possible?

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by AndrewDod View Post
                          So JP what do you blame? The fact of possible Brexit, or the fact that conniving folk have been spending all of their time for more than three years resisting and confounding the necessary preparations, throwing as many spanners into the works as possible?
                          To be fair, I don't think that "conniving folk" are that powerful.

                          Lots of people have tried very hard to prevent brexit from happening, but no one has seriously opposed preparing for it or putting spanners in any actual work.

                          I don't accept the view that by working to try and end or delay brexit negotiations with the EU are being sabotaged, because we're not actually negotiating with the EU in any meaningful way.

                          Theresa May deserves a huge amount of credit for negotiating a withdrawal deal with the EU that covered off or delayed many of the uncertainties created.

                          That would at least have allowed time to work out actual solutions to huge issues or to accept that they weren't actually possible.

                          I put a lot of blame on the May government for giving notice to leave before agreeing an outcome (or even a range of outcomes), because that was simply a stupid thing to do.
                          Supported by most of the opposition as well.

                          I put a lot of blame on people who campaigned (some for many years) to leave the EU without ever having a plan for what was to replace it and a planned route from where we are to that outcome.

                          I place a lot of blame on a campaign for leave that was dishonest, with a parallel unofficial campaign that tapped into an undercurrent of frustration and racism, which wasn't ever going to be addressed by leaving the EU.

                          And I blame David Cameron for holding a referendum, which undermined parliament and for campaigning on such a stupid basis. Calling the campaign "remain" and using negative fear-based arguments wasn't going to succeed against a campaign that could promise anything it wanted. Because when you start to question the promises, it sounds like you're just repeating the same things.

                          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                          Comment


                            Well I agree about May's guilt - she wanted to remain so negotiated a deal which was remain-lite, making us a colony of the EU. Thank goodness that did not get through. After A50 was triggered she went off at top speed, hit the ground running and did...nothing, except arrange a method by which we could stay in the EU. I agree that there were no spanners. The machine was not turned on.
                            Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

                            Comment


                              She negotiated a temporary agreement to allow us to leave and start to negotiate trade deals without a catastrophic exit without a transition period - which is where we now sit.

                              Nothing in that agreement was meant to last (unless it was agreed again).
                              When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                              Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                              Comment


                                Except that is not the case. We would be tied in by the terms forever. Nothing in the actual legal agreement is temporary. The Political Declaration (non binding) is the only document that did anything for us (and that was not much).
                                Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

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