Basement room fire risk....no means of escape

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  • Gyps
    started a topic Basement room fire risk....no means of escape

    Basement room fire risk....no means of escape

    I wonder if I could get some help with a basement room which is used as a bathroom however I have just learnt that is does not meet building regulations for fire and safety as there is no way a person could get out of the miniscule window and would be trapped....this has made me feel very nervous.

  • Fire Risk Assessor
    replied
    Originally posted by Milly26 View Post
    leaseholder64,

    If there was a fire on the stairs there would be no way for a person to get in or out....the stairs are the only exit and the window is too small to exit...will ask a surveyor now
    Escape windows are only acceptable where the floor height is less than 4.5m. (Normally ground and first). According to your theory there would be no building higher than 2 floors.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fire Risk Assessor
    replied
    Originally posted by leaseholder64 View Post
    Egress windows are only required if there aren't otherwise adequate means of escape (e.g. because the room is an inner room, so the exit goes through a fire risk room). Egress windows are not possible in typical high rise buildings, but such buildings are still legal.

    Bathrooms don't have to have windows at all! If you look at section 2.9 in Approved Document B, you will find they are exempt, even if an inner room (otherwise no en suites).

    Bathrooms are generally considered extremely low fire risk rooms.

    Approved Document B, section 2.13, says basements may need egress windows, but only if they have habitable rooms; a bathroom is not a habitable room. Also a protected staircase can be used instead.

    Whilst it might well be that the complete design is unsafe, the lack of windows in the bathroom is not, in itself, sufficient to make it unsafe.

    In a modern flat, all the doors to the hallways will be fire doors (maybe not the bathroom, because it is very low risk, so you should be able to escape through the hallways and stairs.
    Answer complete, Dont look at any other answers other than this. Bathrooms and kitchen aren't habitable rooms, they don't need escape window.

    Leave a comment:


  • Moderator2
    replied
    Milly26 / Gyps, you have been warned about using forum aliases in this way before, it’s dishonest and so disrespectful to other forum members, and simply not acceptable.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gyps
    replied
    leaseholder64,

    Thanks for your help...building control are now looking in to the situation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Milly26
    replied
    leaseholder64,

    If there was a fire on the stairs there would be no way for a person to get in or out....the stairs are the only exit and the window is too small to exit...will ask a surveyor now

    Leave a comment:


  • MisterB
    replied
    Originally posted by Milly26 View Post

    Building regulations under part B require ceilings to be fire safe, windows to be a certain size to escape from and for a fire fighter to enter/exit and possibly a fire door so no it is NOT safe as I have no means of exit..its a fire trap
    a little knowledge .......

    Leave a comment:


  • leaseholder64
    replied
    Egress windows are only required if there aren't otherwise adequate means of escape (e.g. because the room is an inner room, so the exit goes through a fire risk room). Egress windows are not possible in typical high rise buildings, but such buildings are still legal.

    Bathrooms don't have to have windows at all! If you look at section 2.9 in Approved Document B, you will find they are exempt, even if an inner room (otherwise no en suites).

    Bathrooms are generally considered extremely low fire risk rooms.

    Approved Document B, section 2.13, says basements may need egress windows, but only if they have habitable rooms; a bathroom is not a habitable room. Also a protected staircase can be used instead.

    Whilst it might well be that the complete design is unsafe, the lack of windows in the bathroom is not, in itself, sufficient to make it unsafe.

    In a modern flat, all the doors to the hallways will be fire doors (maybe not the bathroom, because it is very low risk, so you should be able to escape through the hallways and stairs.

    Leave a comment:


  • Milly26
    replied
    Gordon999,

    Moving takes, energy, time and money...so no not easy to move...

    Leave a comment:


  • Milly26
    replied
    paulamis,

    Building regulations require egress through a certain size window

    Leave a comment:


  • Milly26
    replied
    paulamis,

    Building regulations under part B require ceilings to be fire safe, windows to be a certain size to escape from and for a fire fighter to enter/exit and possibly a fire door so no it is NOT safe as I have no means of exit..its a fire trap

    Leave a comment:


  • Gordon999
    replied
    If you are living in constant anxiety and stress , it is better if you move to another flat with safer layout .

    Leave a comment:


  • MisterB
    replied
    hard wired interlinked smoke alarms might reduce your anxiety and allow you to poo in peace

    Leave a comment:


  • paulamis
    replied
    I have a bathroom with no window in my house...

    There may be other building reg probs with your basement bathroom, but I don't think you need emergency egress windows on a bathroom.

    Leave a comment:

Latest Activity

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  • 2 or 3 stories
    Paulpopb
    I have been given a upgrade order by the council stating fire hazard 1. The inspector insists because the building is 3 stories, ii have to install an interlinked wired fire alarm system.
    I have 2 flats over 2 floors and an attic that has been boarded out in to 2 rooms but on the orders of a previous...
    25-07-2019, 16:02 PM
  • Reply to 2 or 3 stories
    Paulpopb
    I have an appeal in and because of the changes to BS58__ part 6 in May this year it says because of improvement with alarms etc a mains wired alarm and wired control panel is no longer a requirement so I'm optimistic about the appeal.
    04-10-2019, 21:16 PM
  • Hard Wired Sysyem
    Ian2019
    I have a flat that I rent out that has a “tested with tenant” FireAngel ST 750T smoke alarm and a Carbon Monoxide alarm and a fire blanket in the kitchen.
    The Management Company have recently undertaken a Fire Risk Assessment and informed us that all landlords should comply with BS 5839-6...
    24-09-2019, 11:14 AM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    theartfullodger
    Fine: Reply, in writing, stating you have considered that standard. That's all they've asked you to do....
    25-09-2019, 18:52 PM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    Ian2019
    Thank you both for your information, clear and concise.
    i will seriously look at the screwfix alarm option to replace the existing alarm and I take on board your helpful comments and the education update it has provided for myself.
    25-09-2019, 18:14 PM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    leaseholder64
    What they are probably going by is appendix 6 of "Fire Safety in Purpose Built Blocks of Flats", which is the standard reference for risk assessing blocks like yours. This says:


    With which you comply unless you have done any major electrical wiring work. And:
    ...
    25-09-2019, 12:09 PM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    baldelectrician
    the management company can insist on what they want, I think it is unlikely they can justify you remove a compliant battery system and install a mains one as both now comply with BS 5839 Pt 6 (the standard has been amened as smoke detector and battery technology has developed)

    I am fairly...
    25-09-2019, 11:42 AM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    Ian2019
    Leaseholder64 - that now makes sense. I purchased my flat 12 years ago (to live in - with a glazed door) - but have now married and live at my wife’s flat - hence we rent my old one out. Having had a couple of “bad” tenants - I am beginning to think seriously about selling it now. Thank you.
    24-09-2019, 17:18 PM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    leaseholder64
    If it is a purpose built flat, below you and has proper fire doors, the fire should be contained. The smoke alarms in those flats don't protect you, only the occupiers of those flats. On the other hand their entrance door does protect you.
    24-09-2019, 17:10 PM
  • Reply to Hard Wired Sysyem
    leaseholder64
    No it is nowhere near major work in the sense I used. I'm not even sure if completely rewiring the electrics would trigger the requirements.

    On the other hand, it does appear that over 50% of the flats have been owned by criminals, at one time or another, as replacing a fire door with...
    24-09-2019, 17:09 PM
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