New letting- is Inventory required?

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    New letting- is Inventory required?

    Firstly Merry Christmas everyone and a Peaceful New Year...


    I'm sure the regulars are aware of my story now, so I'll stick to the basics.

    - Moved in Oct 05, no inventory. I sent an email saying flat dirty to LA


    - LA called Oct 06 to hike up rent and for new AST. Nothing signed and no rent rise.
    - Hot water broken for 5 months (pre discovering LLzone Forum )

    - Move out Aug 07 with 1 month notice which is disputed by LL. Drop keys at his house as requested.

    - Write letter 28 days later asking for deposit. Then two follow ups

    - Issue small claim in Oct.

    - Get CCJ in Nov

    - Issue AoE request in Dec. Which is lost by court. Eventually issued on 19th December.

    - AoE form returned to me by LL with a note saying (in effect). 'Oh whoopsee I let this get a bit far didn't I?'

    He is having the judgement set aside and providing invoices for getting the property back to the state it was before we moved in.

    I acknowlegde that the kitchen floor looks at bit rough, it was very cheap (I bought it, LL reimbursed)

    I know from haunting this forum that no inventory is bad for a LL.

    Does it look bad for him because of the lack of correspondence in the last 3 months too?

    I think I just need some reassurance that I'm not going to lose £1000....

    #2
    What were his grounds for getting the judgment set aside? There are strict rules on where that is allowed or not, and sometimes a judge will do what he's not allowed to and if a person doesn't challenge it, they get away with it.

    Comment


      #3
      Thanks for answering!

      Don't know yet.

      I'm sure he only has a month after the judgement was made? It was made on 05/11/07 and wrote to the court 17/12/07.

      Maybe it's hot air on his behalf. At least I got a reaction

      Comment


        #4
        No inventory for my flat- whose risk?

        Amazingly I have moved into a rental property (through agent) and they have not done an inventory (which describes the agent all over as they seem so disorganised) or at least I havent seen / signed one.

        Who is at risk here? My opinion is they are 100% on the basis that they cannot withhold the deposit in any scenerio as they cannot prove the state of the proerty before I moved in.

        Or am I at risk in any way?

        R

        Comment


          #5
          Don't know the answer but I would love to know. In the meantime, do a quick one yourself using a digital photo with a datestamp. Also write an email or letter to the agency stating that you request an inventory to ensure a fair procedure at the end of the tenancy. If they don't answer or do anything, no-one would be very sympathetic towards them should it go to arbitration.

          Comment


            #6
            An inventory is not a legal requirement so the letting agent does not HAVE to do one. Having said that they would be exceedingly stupid not to in the interests if their client (the landlord) and for their own customer service with you as the tenant.

            Your deposit should be protected and should you dispute any deductions at the end of your tenancy the onus is on the landlord to prove the condition at the start, as opposed to you proving that you haven't damaged anything.

            You might consider instructing an independant inventory clerk to carry out a full report though for your own piece of mind. It wouldn't cost the earth and you might even be able to negotiate sharing/passing over the cost to your landlord.

            independant impartial inventories

            Comment


              #7
              Ok thanks.

              I dont really see any point in paying for an independant inventory. I will take some snaps myself and of course will simply dispute any damage.

              No point in me doing their work if its up to them to prove the damage dont you think

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by richiedc View Post
                Who is at risk here?
                The landlord, without a doubt. They cannot make deductions without proof that you've caused damage, and without an initial inventory there's no proof.

                Having said that, are you sure that they haven't been in and taken photos? Perhaps they are relying on this. Alternatively perhaps they have had a inventory carried out by an independent company; in which case perhaps they think you don't need to see it.

                The point is, don't assume that you can now do as much damage as you like and get away with it!

                No point in me doing their work if its up to them to prove the damage dont you think
                Definitely.

                You could take some photos or even get a property inventory done, but I don't know why you would.

                With no inventory, there's practically zero chance that LL will be able to justify deductions. If you get an inventory done, it could easily be used against you.

                Unless there is anything major wrong with the property that you are worried the LL may try to blame on you, I wouldn't worry about it.

                Peter

                Comment


                  #9
                  Thanks Peter... so an independent inventory company do not require the tennant to agree and sign the inventory?? eeek

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I'm with pcwilkins here. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

                    Any good independent inventory company SHOULD get tenants to sign and agree the inventory. Its the only surefire way of making sure everyone is agreed on the contents and conditions at the start of a new tenancy.

                    independant impartial inventories

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by richiedc View Post
                      Thanks Peter... so an independent inventory company do not require the tennant to agree and sign the inventory?? eeek
                      Not necessarily. The inventory is merely designed to prove the state of the property on a certain date. If you end up in court and the LL argues that the carpet was in good condition when you moved in, and you say it wasn't, the inventory will be useful as evidence even if you haven't signed it --- provided that it was carried out by a professional, independent person.

                      It's a bit like if you scratch my car today. You might argue that scratch was there yesterday; I would argue it wasn't. Obviously I won't have a piece of paper with your signature on it saying that the scratch wasn't there yesterday, but if I can summon the bloke who I pay to wash my car, and he says the scratch wasn't there when he cleaned it last week, that'll help my cause and damage your cause.

                      Of course it's always best for an LA to get T to sign the inventory, as then there can be no debate over whether the person who has signed it is independent. But if LA doesn't have an inventory with your signature on it, an inventory with the signature of someone from "XYZ Inventories Ltd" on it might be the next best thing...

                      Peter

                      Comment


                        #12
                        And to my mind it's best for T to have an inventory with L's signature on it. That gives T an opportunity to go through the property and find the faults that are there when he moves in, so that he cannot be blamed when he moves out.

                        If XYZ inventories Ltd didn't notice the scratch, then I should suggest that you would have been better off with a full inventory.
                        The contents of this note are neither advice nor a definitive answer. If you plan to rely on this, you should pay somebody for proper advice.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Grange View Post
                          And to my mind it's best for T to have an inventory with L's signature on it. That gives T an opportunity to go through the property and find the faults that are there when he moves in, so that he cannot be blamed when he moves out.
                          But unless LL can prove that scratch wasn't there when T moved in (not just that scratch wasn't on inventory), they can't blame T.

                          If XYZ inventories Ltd didn't notice the scratch, then I should suggest that you would have been better off with a full inventory.
                          But XYZ Inventories has carried out a full inventory; it's just that T hasn't seen it.

                          If they didn't notice the scratch, that doesn't mean T is automatically liable for it; LL has to prove that the scratch was not there, not just that XYZ Inventories didn't record it. In other words, if inventory says "Pine kitchen table with no marks or scratches" and there is now a scratch, then T is responsible; but if table is just not mentioned, then T isn't necessarily.

                          Just because a piece of damage isn't on the inventory, doesn't prove that it wasn't there --- an inventory is designed to prove what was there, not what wasn't, surely.

                          So I still don't see that T should get an inventory done. Particularly under the new TDS rules.

                          Peter

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Inventory

                            Could anyone recommend a decent easy to use inventory form, so many are confusing and difficult to use.

                            Thanks in advance

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by mjcroot View Post
                              Could anyone recommend a decent easy to use inventory form, so many are confusing and difficult to use.

                              Thanks in advance
                              I would recommend using a professional clerk.
                              Now signature free.

                              Comment

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