Key for French door - is landlord obliged to provide it.

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    Key for French door - is landlord obliged to provide it.

    Hello,

    I am new to the forum as a poster but have consulted from time to time in the past.

    My son is a student and shares a house with 4 other student friends.

    His room is on the ground floor and has a PVC french door to the outside decking.

    He would like to open the door on occasion but there is no key. When they requested the key in the Autumn the landlord said he would look for one and when pressed said it wasn't a priority for him. (!?!)
    Either the landlord can't be bothered to look or doesn't want to go to the bother of getting a replacement but is he under any obligation to?
    and if he doesn't what recourse does my son have?

    It being Winter it's not necessarily a major problem now but in Spring and Summer it would be a shame if my son can't open the door.

    #2
    I doubt that the landlord has any obligation to provide a key, unless it was part of a fire route.
    A call to the council(as it appears to be an HMO) would probably be a good starting point.
    Allow tenants to protect their own deposits. I want free money when they do it wrong

    Comment


      #3
      Depends: If the tenancy agreement or inventory state no key, doors not to be opened (the case with one of my houses..) probably he doesn't. [my french doors have a bar preventing opening anyway & the balcony they open onto is no longer there..... 12 foot drop... I really should get some decking done...]

      Is this a fire-exit from the room/rooms?? I'd suggest the tenants (ie not you...- you have no standing in the matter, and kids need to grow up & sort their own issues out) write the landlord, copy agent a calm polite letter asking for a key as the tenant would prefer not to have to involve council/fire-service in this 'elf-'n-safety issue... See here for general guidance & draft letter.
      http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad...n_private_lets
      I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

      Comment


        #4
        thesaint,

        I did see the contract as a garantor, but don't recall if it is HMO though they are 5 students sharing so it should be I suppose.

        theartfullodger,

        I don't recall anything about fire routes but this would be a concern if it were me as this is the only window in his room, the only other exit being the bedroom door (which can also be locked, in theory)


        thanks ;-)

        Comment


          #5
          If I were renting a property to 5 students and there was a french window opening onto some decking, I'd lock it and lose the key as well.
          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

          Comment


            #6
            With 5 unrelated people it's a HMO but probably (depends on local council rules, check their website ) no requirement for licence. . e.g.
            https://www.newham.gov.uk/Pages/Serv...-licences.aspx


            But needs to comply (fire doors, etc etc etc..)
            http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad...occupation_hmo

            Is it individual tenancy "Mr W Torn, room 3, 63 Acacia Avenue..." or "joint-and-several" (all named on one signed tenancy to rent 63 Acacia Avenue)??
            I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

            Comment


              #7
              it's joint and several. Does that mean that they are not considered to be more than one household?
              - the property doesn't seem to be on the council's register of HMOs

              Comment


                #8
                No, they're not a single household.

                Councils requirements for licensing vary, but normally a large HMO needs a licence, but that's usually 5 people in more than one household and a building three stories high.
                And there are exclusions for purpose built flats..
                When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                Comment


                  #9
                  No, unless they are all living in sin and/or all related (mind boggles) it is still a HMO: But, I repeat, probably (depends on local council rules, check their website ) no requirement for licence which will usually be the only ones on their register.
                  Is your home a house in multiple occupation?
                  Your home is probably an HMO if:

                  three or more unrelated people live there as at least 2 separate households – for example, 3 single people with their own rooms, or 2 couples each sharing a room
                  the people living there share basic amenities – for example, a kitchen and/or bathroom
                  Joint & several does not change that.

                  A landlord really doesn't want council doing a HMO/whatever inspection so may suddenly become "keen" to find that key...
                  I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                    No, they're not a single household.

                    Councils requirements for licensing vary, but normally a large HMO needs a licence, but that's usually 5 people in more than one household and a building three stories high.
                    And there are exclusions for purpose built flats..
                    Ok I wasn't sure if this was AND or OR

                    HMO licence for a shared home
                    Your landlord must get a licence from the council if the HMO:

                    is at least 3 storeys high
                    has 5 or more unrelated people live in it
                    has 2 or more separate households living there

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by theartfullodger View Post

                      A landlord really doesn't want council doing a HMO/whatever inspection so may suddenly become "keen" to find that key...
                      They may yet to have to use that deterrent to get him to hurry up and unblock their downstairs toilet. He seems to be suggesting they are responsible for paying the plumber. :-)

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Worn and torn View Post
                        They may yet to have to use that deterrent to get him to hurry up and unblock their downstairs toilet. He seems to be suggesting they are responsible for paying the plumber. :-)
                        He is responsible: If it was the tenant's fault he is at liberty to attempt to recover the costs from them.
                        http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad...sible_for_what
                        Landlord and tenant responsibilities for repairs

                        Your landlord is responsible for most repairs in your home. This applies to private, council and housing association landlords.

                        Landlord's repair responsibilities
                        Your landlord is responsible for repairs, including to:

                        the structure and exterior of the building, including the walls, stairs and bannisters, roof, external doors and windows
                        sinks, baths, toilets and other sanitary fittings, including pipes and drains
                        heating and hot water
                        chimneys and ventilation
                        electrical wiring
                        etc etc etc
                        Calm polite letter to landlord, copy agent, keep copy.
                        http://england.shelter.org.uk/__data...or_repair.docx
                        I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Well toilets rarely block themselves, so the cost of the plumber is likely to be recharged to them anyway.
                          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                            Well toilets rarely block themselves, so the cost of the plumber is likely to be recharged to them anyway.
                            Possibly, maybe they should refrain from using toilet paper.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Most people would not believe what students put down toilets and sinks.
                              Kitchen roll and A4 paper is a favourite student toilet blocker.

                              Male students particularly have issues with a shared facility that is no one's specific responsibility to clean or maintain.
                              When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                              Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                              Comment

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