Tenant painted rental property

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    #16
    Crikey me AndrewDod- I am glad you are not my landlord. I would be too scared to actually LIVE in the house......

    I might pluck up the courage to make an occasional visit but reckon I would live in the outside shed to avoid any wear and tear / accidental damage occurring

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      #17
      Originally posted by AndrewDod View Post
      Yes but in terms of the main thing you are asking -- you cannot return it to its original condition. Even if you could repaint it exactly the original colour the landlord would have the benefit of an extra layer of paint and the inevitable changes to border lines. If every tenant did this it would be a disaster.

      Frankly if you did this to me I would blow a gasket, kick you out as soon as I could and omit all the various ignorings that I do when dealing with a deposit. What a liberty and a damn cheek to think this is just OK is what I would be thinking.

      And by the way, holes in paper cannot be fixed (as you say) but neither can holes in walls. A fixed hole is a drilled brick filled with plaster -- it is not "fixed".
      I would ignore this post - it is not a real comment from a sane person! And AndrewDod be careful - if this kind of thing makes you "blow a gasket" you are heading for a heart attack!
      Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

      Comment


        #18
        OP, this thread started out with some quite reasonable replies but some people are having a hard time thinking logically it seems.

        Firstly, you have just renewed your contract for 12 months. Your LL can not do ANYTHING to your deposit until the end of the tenancy. If there is a break clause in your agreement after say 6 months then he may be able to use that and kick you out earlier. However, most break clauses are badly worded and thus deemed unfair (and hence unenforceable). At the end of your 12 month term your LL can, if he wished, evict you using a s21 notice.

        You have not explicitly said yet so I will ask, what does your agreement actually say about redocorating walls? Even IF there is a clause in there restricting you from decorating I would take the view that clause would fall foul of the OFTs guidance. A clause prohibiting redecoration means the tenant can not repair a scuff mark on a wall himself or worse, in the event of a long lease, has to live in a deteriorating home whilst paying the same rent. IMO, if such a clause is to be valid and LL seeks to exclude Ts ability to redecorate then LL has to clearly take on that himself and include in the clause words to that effect.

        FWIW, OFT guidance explicitly refers to clauses about moving furniture, having curtains and restriction of choice of colour as being unfair.

        As to some of the ludicrous posts,

        Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
        It's not possible to return the property to the condition it was in (less reasonable wear and tear) if you repaint it.
        1) The original colours (plus the effects of time) are unique - new paint that's meant to be the same colour won't be the same.
        Change does not equal damage. If the LL has been provided with a brand new red wall compared to a red wall that was 2 years old (at least given the lengths of the tenancies being discussed) he is almost certainly in a better position, not a worse one. And that is still true even IF the shade of red is ever so slightly different.

        Or if T has been in the property for additional time not mentioned (or stays for longer than this term) then they can quite reasonably do absolutely nothing since a LL should be prepared to redecorate his property every ~3yrs anyway.

        Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
        2) The decor may hold some significance for the landlord - last thing painted by his mother, a decorator, before she died of an overdose of Dulux.
        This is plainly ridiculous.

        Firstly, emotional significance does not affect the amount of damage that a LL can claim. Secondly, it seems unlikely to me that a contract between tenant and LL is one of the exceptions to the rule that emotional damages arent awarded under a breach of contract. Thirdly, Ill mention remoteness and causation as both seem dubious at best.

        Originally posted by AndrewDod View Post
        Yes but in terms of the main thing you are asking -- you cannot return it to its original condition. Even if you could repaint it exactly the original colour the landlord would have the benefit of an extra layer of paint and the inevitable changes to border lines. If every tenant did this it would be a disaster.

        And by the way, holes in paper cannot be fixed (as you say) but neither can holes in walls. A fixed hole is a drilled brick filled with plaster -- it is not "fixed".
        As to the first bit, see above. As to the second bit, a tenant contracts with a LL for the USE of a property. He does not have to return the property in the EXACT same state as he received it. If every property in the UK had a convenant attached that said that the owner could not affix anything to the internal structure of the premises because of what you have just said - Do you think that would be reasonable? Do you not have picture frames or decorations of some sort up in your own home? In terms of your un "fixed" brick - what damage have you suffered (assuming its indistinguishable from the surrounding wall)?

        ------

        To OP, I suggest you converse with your LL and apologise for repainting the wall without asking permission. Point out that it was done with the intention of returning it back to the original colour before you leave the property and that you can confirm the exact colour to be used with him when that time comes.

        However, if he asks for compensation of any kind Id politely but firmly tell him no.

        Comment


          #19
          To OP, I suggest you converse with your LL and apologise for repainting the wall without asking permission. Point out that it was done with the intention of returning it back to the original colour before you leave the property and that you can confirm the exact colour to be used with him when that time comes.

          However, if he asks for compensation of any kind Id politely but firmly tell him no.[/QUOTE]

          Thankyou- this is all really great advice. We have now also texted LL to apologise and confirm that this was done with the intention of returning it to original colour and that we won't do anything else without permission. Hopefully he will see that we are good tenants and this will b the end of it all

          Comment


            #20
            Maybe an over-reaction on part of LL, but OP is not the perfect tenant suggested - repainted in diff colour without prior LL permission. A builder is not a professional painter, nor resp to LL. What if original colour is not avail, will any red suffice?
            IMO redecorating restrictions are not unfair contract terms.

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by Adamshouse View Post
              Crikey me AndrewDod-reckon I would live in the outside shed to avoid any wear and tear / accidental damage occurring
              I can help you there, I can introduce you to a few landlords in Southall............
              I offer no guarantee that anything I say is correct. wysiwyg

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                #22
                This is crazy! You can't expect a tenant to live in ahouse and not do some redecorating, especially if they're going to return it to the original colour - they've even bought the original paint. A red wall? come on, who can live with that?

                Comment


                  #23
                  What does the tenancy agreement say? What obligations and restrictions are placed on the tenant?

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by mariner View Post
                    Maybe an over-reaction on part of LL, but OP is not the perfect tenant suggested - repainted in diff colour without prior LL permission. A builder is not a professional painter, nor resp to LL. What if original colour is not avail, will any red suffice?
                    IMO redecorating restrictions are not unfair contract terms.
                    To be entirely fair to us- we haven't claimed to be perfect tenants. We have said that we are entirely in the wrong on this point and will rectify. I have said that otherwise, we are excellent tenants. NO tenant is 100% perfect (unless they don't actually use the property that they are paying for).

                    My father in law IS a professional painter (the term builder is a term which encompasses his trade as a whole). He is, in addition, a master craftsman cabinet maker and makes super luxury kitchens, installs them and paints/ lays floor/ appliances, etc. To be honest, with his expert level of craft and skill, you would be unlikely to get a better finish from any other tradesperson. This is a 'builder' who charges over £250,000 for a kitchen (just to put his 'skill level' into context!!)

                    We have already bought the replacement paint (done at the time of repainting) to ensure we had the exact colour in case it was ever discontinued.

                    In terms of a non decorating clause being unfair; I agree, it is probably not unfair, and the LL has done nothing wrong. BUT, I would suggest it is UNWISE to have a property with a red downstairs if you want to ensure your property is always tenanted. There is a reason the LLs/ Ts like neutral colours-so any tenant an move in and their furniture will match (it is an unfurnished let). Remember that the property was untenanted or 5 months before we took it (the agent told us it was because of the colours).

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Adam, I wonder if you could have an 'off the record' chat with the agent when you decide to leave:

                      Suggest he brings viewers to see the place with the magnolia walls, and see how many offer to rent, and then if they don't get any offers, you will happily repaint it red. Perhaps then, (hopefully) landlord will see the error of his ways.
                      To save them chiming in, JPKeates, Theartfullodger, Boletus, Mindthegap, Macromia, Holy Cow & Ted.E.Bear think the opposite of me on almost every subject.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by JK0 View Post
                        Adam, I wonder if you could have an 'off the record' chat with the agent when you decide to leave:

                        Suggest he brings viewers to see the place with the magnolia walls, and see how many offer to rent, and then if they don't get any offers, you will happily repaint it red. Perhaps then, (hopefully) landlord will see the error of his ways.
                        I agree with this! I cannot imagine why the agent has not pointed this out to the LL already!!

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                          #27
                          Agent may well have/probably has already pointed it out: However there is no law against being a daft landlord...
                          I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

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                            #28
                            Storm in a teacup.

                            Yes, you should have asked for permission to re-paint, you do admit this.

                            No, the Landlord should not go off the deep-end regarding this... especially so late in the day.

                            Leave it as it is, re-paint it back to red etc. at the end of the tenancy (or the current fixed term / break clause) and Landlord is, effectively, impotent until that time. Landlord can expect you to re-paint it before leaving (which you will do) but not before. And Landlord could try and make a deposit deduction if so minded, but difficult to get an objective person to agree with that if the re-paint is done to a high standard - so just dispute it if it ever happens.

                            Landlord sounds silly. I sense your desire to maintain positive relations... but sometimes you have to accept you're dealing with an idiot and it can't be achieved.

                            Rest easy. Sit back and appreciate your lovely magnolia wall.

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                              #29
                              IME many Ts dislike magnolia, nondescript rental image. Had 1 T paint over magnolia with deep primary colours 'to make a feature'. No prior request, T charged for restitution.

                              #1 We are excellent and responsible tenants;

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                                #30
                                Originally posted by Adamshouse View Post
                                . This is a 'builder' who charges over £250,000 for a kitchen (just to put his 'skill level' into context!!)

                                .
                                "GULP! " 'Wow! --- I think you'll be fine after communicating with the LL . Im a first time one and I think we're likely to have a little wobble when the agent (rightly) flags up some rule has been breached , wrongly thinking in our inexperience that its a symptom of a future tenant from hell and immediate action must be taken to avoid the sky falling . Im sure he'll be reasonable now youve explained the position properly.

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