Problems with rodent infestation: mouse/mice/rats/etc.

[mind the gap]

No, but as the T occupies the premises then L can't be held responsible to rid same of pests when he doesn't live there. It's a situation beyond the L's control so it's the T's responsibility usually by implication.

However, it is something LLs can insure against. If a hooligan damaged the property by lobbing a brick through the window, or spray painting grafitti on the outside wall, the tenants could not be expected to pay for the damage to be repaired, could they? Similarly, if a few thousand wasps decide to move in and build a nest, I cannot see how the tenants can be held liable for the cost of removal. It would be a different matter if tenants had caused the infestation, but when they haven't, it seems unfair to charge them for it.

Any pest control officers out there with a view on whether occupants can be blamed for infestations?

[bunny]

clause

My tenancy states the following if it's of any use to you:

Pay and arrange for the removal of all vermin, pests and insects, if infestation begins during the Term, woodworm and wood boring insects excepted, unless such infestation occurs as a failure of the Landlord to fulfil his repairing obligations.

I've never had the need to use it - yet! I did have a property with "a" mouse that jumped in the tenant's hair whilst she was on the sofa but I talked them through the problem!

[Beeber]

My local council makes clear to tenants that they hold landlords responsible for pest control and will enforce this

"If you live in private rented accommodation, your landlord is responsible for pest control. ... We can ensure your landlord takes action if you have problems with:

Cockroaches
Mice
Rats
Pharaoh ants (or other tropical ants)
Pigeons (only if the nest is causing problems with mess, smells, flies or other insects)
Wasps (only if the nest is causing a problem e.g. blocking an air vent or gas appliance vent)

If we find your complaint is something we are able to help with, we will usually serve a notice on the owner of the property. This is a legal document listing the work that they must do to solve the problem. If the landlord does not meet the conditions of the notice, we can take formal action against them.

Your case officer will discuss the problems you are experiencing and will take account of your wishes. We'll keep you fully informed at all stages and send you copies of any notices we serve on your landlord.

We normally serve a notice about 2 weeks after our first inspection. We need to do a great deal of paperwork before we can serve one of these notices. The notice usually gives your landlord 28 days in which to deal with the problem. It may take longer than this for the work to be completed and the problem to be resolved. "

[bunny]

How does that work then? I assume from your post that you are not from the council. What is the legal authority of the council to do this if the tenant is the cause of the infestation rather than the landlord which is perfectly possible in my experience.

My local council makes clear to tenants that they hold landlords responsible for pest control and will enforce this

"If you live in private rented accommodation, your landlord is responsible for pest control. ... We can ensure your landlord takes action if you have problems with:

Cockroaches
Mice
Rats
Pharaoh ants (or other tropical ants)
Pigeons (only if the nest is causing problems with mess, smells, flies or other insects)
Wasps (only if the nest is causing a problem e.g. blocking an air vent or gas appliance vent)

If we find your complaint is something we are able to help with, we will usually serve a notice on the owner of the property. This is a legal document listing the work that they must do to solve the problem. If the landlord does not meet the conditions of the notice, we can take formal action against them.

Your case officer will discuss the problems you are experiencing and will take account of your wishes. We'll keep you fully informed at all stages and send you copies of any notices we serve on your landlord.

We normally serve a notice about 2 weeks after our first inspection. We need to do a great deal of paperwork before we can serve one of these notices. The notice usually gives your landlord 28 days in which to deal with the problem. It may take longer than this for the work to be completed and the problem to be resolved. "

[Southcoast Landlord]

My tenancy states the following if it's of any use to you:

Pay and arrange for the removal of all vermin, pests and insects, if infestation begins during the Term, woodworm and wood boring insects excepted, unless such infestation occurs as a failure of the Landlord to fulfil his repairing obligations.

I've never had the need to use it - yet! I did have a property with "a" mouse that jumped in the tenant's hair whilst she was on the sofa but I talked them through the problem!

Thanks Bunny, thats what Im after.
To clarify...

The tenants had a visit from their friends who brought their dog along.
After they had left, the place was crawling with fleas.
they phoned the council who told them they will charge a LL £300, or a tenant £45. BUT the AST must make clear who is responsible for said payment.
The tenants have told me they want to pay seeing as though they introduced the fleas!
Cheers
SCL

[oaktree]

I've never had a problem with getting tenants to pay for the removal of normal day-to-day pests i.e. wasp nests, ants, woodlice etc. I don't think its unreasonable for tenants to pay for things like this.

We'll deal with rats, mice, cockroaches as a landlords responsibility unless it is the tenants lifestyle which has caused them to appear.

[jghomer]

Damage to electrics by Rats!!

A few months ago one of my properties had a rat problem, which we dealt with at the time. It has since come to light that they have chewed most of the electric cabling in the house, resulting in a need for an almost complete rewire!

It's going to cost a fortune with decorating after!

The insurers say we're not covered.

Before i start a fight with them i wondered if anyone has had any similar experiences and can offer their thoughts?

[MetropolitanAnthony]

I have not had problems with rats eating cables but I am just finishing off a rewire of a flat I own. My problem is that previous visiting electricians have cut corners just to get any job done quickly. This has left me with a jumble of spurs off spurs, wall conduit and socket boxes glued to skirting boards.

Provided the rewire is confined to bedrooms and living rooms you should be able to do the work yourself. Materials are cheap at £30 to £40 for a roll of mains cable and some new junction boxes. Although it will involve taking up floorboards and carpets.

If rewiring of kitchens or bathrooms is involved do not do the work yourself. Get an electrician in and notify the council.

[Telometer]

Damage from vermin is very often excluded from insurance policies.

[PaulF]

It's about Part "P" certification which means that any work in a bathroom or kitchen needs to be carried out by a "competent" person; Part P covers this and will make sure your property insurance is not invalidated.

As far as I know all insurance policies exclude damage by vermin or animals.

[Ericthelobster]

If rewiring of kitchens or bathrooms is involved do not do the work yourself. Get an electrician in and notify the council.

There's nothing to stop any member of the public from rewiring a complete house if they want to, including kitchen and bathroom, providing they go through the right channels (ie submitting a Building Control application).

Building Control will then organise whatever inspections and testing of the works that they see fit (normally subcontracted to a suitably qualified individual), and will issue the appropriate certification when it's complete.

No need to 'notify the council' if you use a Part-P qualified electrician (they self-certify).

[Rodent1]

Recently had similar problem....rodents(some joker gonna post a ttp onmy user name for sure !!) had taken out downstairs light circuit ion one of my props ...when icame to investigate ...i was absolutely gabsmacked and disgusted by steate of the place ....called coucil pest control who laid 49 rodent baits ....

The was mouse/rat **** everywhere ...onthe tv in the cupboards , draining board, top of W/m , worktops //.....I MEAN EVERYWHERE ...pest control where amazed that 5 people were living there and had not got ill ...so was I ....read the riot act and called electrician ..............who refuses to work in there until it was properly cleaned ..
To cut a long story short ...T got billed £700 for the "works" and a very long and loud mouthful from me ...! they left prop 6 weeks later (end of fixed term ....) prop had complete redec (which finished off rest of their bond) and i swallowed the rest and is now A1 and "pretty" again ...........

Txxxxrs!


The Rodent

[Shelly24]

Problems with flat's windows/heating- and mice

Hi everyone,

I am so stressed out at the moment, just needing some advice really because im not sure what i am allowed to do or what i can do about my flat.

I have lived in my flat for 10 months which I am renting through a lettings agency. I had a 6 month contract, after this it rolls over monthly.
I was very desperate to move in at the time and this place seemed clean and tidy, when i moved in i was told there was a leak in the roof which has now been fixed and that was the only issue i could see as there was a bit of water staining on the wall.

The day i moved in all the windows were open, this was because the cleaner had been in and left them open but i could not close them again properly as it seems the windows had swelled? I had to wedge some of them shut and they now do not open, one window has a handle and lock missing and is literally wedged shut.
The intercom has never worked since i moved in. I told my agency about these things straight away but nothing was done.

A few moths later when it got a bit colder I tried the storage heaters (which i was told were new) and they dont work. The dials are broken and they do not heat up, im not sure if electric is getting to them as im not allowed to call in service people im told. I have had no heating since i moved in and im so cold.
Now it is rainy and horrible and the roof is leaking, i was told it was fixed but my sofa is soaked and you can see it dripping off the ceiling.

There is also a VERY bad problem with mice. The place is riddled with them and i have to bleach my work surfaces everytime i cook food as they crawl all over it in the night, there is mouse poo everywhere.
I told the agency who told me to contact the council which i did, traps were put down which caught 2 mice but then they got clever and wouldnt go near them, the council then said about poison but the agency said no as they will die and rot under the floor boards. they said to me 'well my place has mice, its that time of year'!!!!!

i outlined all these problems in a letter 5 weeks ago and heard nothing, no phone call of anything so i withheld my rent for that month to get their attention. instead of calling me to discuss the problems, they called my guarantours and asked them to pay my rent!! I couldnt beleive it!
I went down to their office and had a meeting about the problems, they said they will fix the heating when i pay the rent, I said no because ive had no heating for 10 months and they should of done something about it 5 weeks ago when i wrote the letter.
I have been to the environmental health today who came to assess the property and said they cannot condemn it as they are not electricians and cannot say if the heaters are working or not!!!!

I just dont know what I can do legally. Im so upset.

I have put a holding fee down on another property with central heating today. I am fed up of waking up with a headache, runny nose and being able to see my own breath. I have had to use my rent money to do this.

I just feel that i am being asked the live in a freezing mouse infested flat and all they want to do is take my money. I am not a farm animal. My girlfriend wouldnt even keep her horses like this!

[jeffrey]

What you should do: tell L to comply with s.11 of LTA 1985 or else he/she/it will be prosecuted.
What L should then do: as this property is a flat, L is probably only a leaseholder, so ought to press reversioner to rectify defects to structure.

[Shelly24]

hi, i beleive the landlady has a share in the freeehold (or at least that is what the agency told me).
i do not have any contact details atall for the landlasy, i must deal through my agency so should i write a letter again? sorry what is LTA 1985?