AST who signs first

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    AST who signs first

    This may seem a silly question. Who should sign the AST first LL or tenant?

    #2
    I get tenant to sign first, after I have vacant property & deposit , rent paid & receipted & references etc checked.

    Ie I want tenant committed 1st
    I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

    Comment


      #3
      No one "should" sign it first.

      How would you prove that one party signed it first if you were to rely on it in court?
      Allow tenants to protect their own deposits. I want free money when they do it wrong

      Comment


        #4
        I agree with thesaint that there is no legal answer - after all, the written agreement is just for convenience in most cases. However, I also agree with Artful with regard to the practicalities.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by theartfullodger View Post
          Ie I want tenant committed 1st
          It takes two to tango. The tenant cannot be committed before the landlord is.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Lawcruncher View Post
            It takes two to tango. The tenant cannot be committed before the landlord is.
            Do I take it LC that if a landlord were to send an unsigned tenancy agreement to a prospective tenant then that in itself indicates that the landlord agrees to offer/be bound to the agreement as it is sent?

            If there were any amendments made to it whilst it was in the tenants hands, at what point do those amendments become binding on the landlord or tenant?

            Following the logic - if the tenant sends an amended (but unsigned) agreement back to the landlord, does that indicate the tenant has accepted all the terms in the agreement that have not been altered? Or would that be conditional upon the landlord accepting the amendments? Would we have an 'accepted' tenancy agreement signed by no-one?

            If the tenant sends an amended & signed agreement back to the landlord - what if the landlord disagrees with the amendments?

            Comment


              #7
              Agreed, but if no money & no references, no deal, no signatures by anyone..

              btw in Scotland it is quite common to date&time signatures as the sequence of documents defines if you have equivalent of AST or AT. So yes, you can see who signed when!
              I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

              Comment


                #8
                Tenant signs first.


                Letting agent : -
                Your references and credit check have come back as fine.
                There are terms and conditions, house rules and estate rules,
                head lease obligations, and utility obligations which are all itemised
                in the A.S.T.

                Before we can hand over the keys, on receipt of rent and deposit,
                we need your assurance that you will abide by the A.S.T. conditions,
                by signing the A.S.T. to verify you will observe all the conditions of
                the rental.
                Please confim your acceptance of the terms and conditions of the
                rental by signing the enclosed A.S.T.

                So in my mind, the tenant signs first, as if not signed that the
                prospective tenant will observe the A.S.T. , then the flat / house
                cannot be offered to them.

                R.a.M.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by ram View Post

                  So in my mind, the tenant signs first, as if not signed that the
                  prospective tenant will observe the A.S.T. , then the flat / house
                  cannot be offered to them.

                  R.a.M.

                  Please read that back, and see if it makes sense to you.
                  Allow tenants to protect their own deposits. I want free money when they do it wrong

                  Comment


                    #10
                    There are other legal arguments (postal rule, invitation to treat) but that's getting *way* too technical. Needlessly so in this post. I would agree with most posts here; it doesn't matter. It's obvious that the LL/agent will sign it when he receives the signed (by TT) copy back, then send on a copy to you. The LL would not, after all, send you an agreement to sign and not intend to sign it himself.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by thesaint View Post
                      Please read that back, and see if it makes sense to you.
                      Makes sence to me !

                      If the tenant does not sign the tenancy agreement, then the agent
                      cannot go ahead with the rental, therefore cannot offer them the
                      tenancy, cannot offer them the keys to enter, as they have not agreed
                      to observe the A.S.T.

                      If I refuse to sign the contract for a hire car, I don't get the car, irrespective if the contract is pre signed by Mr. Boss.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Why would you ask someone to sign a contract if you have not offered them the property already?

                        Originally posted by ram View Post
                        as they have not agreed
                        to observe the A.S.T.
                        If they don't sign the contract, are you suggesting that they aren't legally bound to observe the terms in it?
                        Allow tenants to protect their own deposits. I want free money when they do it wrong

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by thesaint View Post
                          Why would you ask someone to sign a contract if you have not offered them the property already?

                          If they don't sign the contract, are you suggesting that it isn't legally binding?
                          I'm not going there.

                          But, here is the property on offer.
                          We withdraw the offer if you refuse to sign the tenancy agreement.

                          Nowt wrong with that.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by ram View Post
                            I'm not going there.

                            But, here is the property on offer.
                            We withdraw the offer if you refuse to sign the tenancy agreement.

                            Nowt wrong with that.
                            I think that's what thesaint said...

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by thesaint View Post
                              Why would you ask someone to sign a contract if you have not offered them the property already?



                              If they don't sign the contract, are you suggesting that they aren't legally bound to observe the terms in it?
                              Even with that last second edit.

                              Comment

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