Filling in N5B and a few questions

[sam45]

Hi,

I am doing the N5b form myself (as I have read that you can diy) and I have read various posts on this forum and am a little confused with a couple of things that I just needed to double check please.

a) Number 2 says 'On the ........,the claimant entered into a written tenancy agreement with the defendants.A copy of it markd A is attached to this claim The tenancy did not immediately follow an assured tenancy which was not an assured shorthold tenancy. One or more subsequent written tenancy agreements have been entered into. A copy of the most recent one, made on ........ marked A1 is also attached to the claim form.

WHat do I put in here as I have 2 tenancy agreements (renewed each year) - the first 16 Dec 2009 to 15 Dec 2010 (signed 16th Dec 2009. The second 2 January 2011 to 1 Januaury 2012 (dated 17 November 2010).Is it the dates of the contracts or when contract commenced and ended?

b) Number 5 where it asks for the date of the notice, I presume means the date on 21(1)b and
not when I deemed it served (ie next day or 2 days in post , etc). Also if hand delivered through letter box with witness then is this 'delivered in person' or what do I write here?

c) What other things do I need - N115, N215 certificate of service and witness statement(are latter 2 same thing)?

Any advice would be really appreciated. Thanks

[Snorkerz]

a) Attach both - the original marked "A" and the most recent, marked "A1"
b) That would be the date of service.
If hand delivered, write "XXX on xx/xx/2011 and witnessed by YYY. A witness satatement siged by YYY is attached (marked C1)".
If by post write "First class mail posted on zzz, certificate of posting attached (marked C1)"

Attach the tenancy agreement(s) marked A, A1, A2 etc
S21 Notice, Marked C
Proofs of service marked C1, C2, C3 etc
I would also attach a copy of the confirmation email from the deposit scheme confirmin protecton. It isn't required anymore, but was until April last year and some judges may still expect to see it.

[sam45]

Thank you so much for your response.

Sorry I should have been more accurate. With regards to my question a), is it the dates when the 2 tenancies began or the dates of when the contracts were signed? As these are both different.

The first tenancy contract was signed on 16 Dec 2009 and this is also the date of when the tenancy began but the second years contract was signed on the 17 Nov 2009 with the tenancy
beginning 2 Jan 2011? (In addition, the second contract was signed (not began) before the
first contract expired).

The N5B form point 2 asks what date "....the claimant entered into a written tenancy
agreement" ? It is not clear if they mean the date the contracts were signed or the dates of
when the tenancy contracts began.

It is also interesting that when I looked at the defence form N11B that the tenant would fill if they wished to raise a defence- it asks the tenant " Do you agree the date, in section 2 ofthe claim form, when the claimant says the tenancy began? If No, on what date did it begin? ".

It seems the forms are not very clear. What should I do?

Thanks

[Snorkerz]

I think you should put the date the tenancy began. If it would gie you peace of mind, attach a covering letter (there used to be a notes section) explaining that the tenancy began on the dates shown but the second contract was signed on 17/11/10.

Is there a reason the 2nd contract did not begin on 16 Dec 2011?

[sam45]

Yes there is a two week gap before the second tenancy (dated 17 Nov 2010) started on 2 Jan 2011 (it should have started on 16 Dec 2010). This is because the tenant asked us if we could change the dates on the new contract from 16 Dec 2010 to start 2 Jan 2011 because he said it would help him pay his rent on time (the first year of tenancy his rent had been constantly in arrears).I also put an interest clause on the second contract to cover for late rent payments.

With regards to the signing date of the second contract 17 Nov 2010- I wanted to sign early by a month as the tenant was not giving us any reply as to what he wanted to do- stay or leave. Quite frankly I did not want to take any chances with him and have any problems or be left with no time to look for any other tenants.

Do you think the issue with contract dates will create problems? I can,t afford to have the judge throw the application out as this will delay matters and right now I have had no rent paid for 4 months.

Thanks

[Snorkerz]

No, I can't see it as an issue - you haven't done anything wrong, it is just common for the tenancy period dates to remain static.

Why not section 8 if he owes so much? You can get an order for the missing rent with that and (if done online) it is cheaper.

If he gets housing benefit - have you approached the council for direct payment?

[sam45]

Hi,

I did not go for section 8 as I thought it was a longer process with a court hearing especially

a)if the T defends with repairs (these done now), condensation, compensation,etc

b)I might have to pay T costs

c) you cannot pursue both N5B and section 8 at same time

If you can, then is it worth doing a section 8 now that the tenancy contract has expired and is rolling?

Also I have filled in N5B form ready to go and just to make sure-

a) do I fill in the issue date (top of first page)

b) the section 21 notice was delivered by hand through letterbox by me. I am attaching a witness statement but shall I fill a N215 myself and attach this too?

c)the deposit went into scheme late but before section 21 was served- will this be a problem?

d)it was posted to T so shall I send the post evidence of postage for this?
A
Sorry for asking so many questions but I am just trying to cover myself as T is deliberately looking for all reasons to live rent free.