Normal? No mention of Tenancy Deposit Protection Scheme to be used on details sent.

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    #16
    Mekly, please do not start new threads for queries related to one pot AST you may get wrong advice if all facts are not presented

    Mods. Please merge 3 threads

    Meekly in your other posts there was no mention of a deposit reqd, only 6 months advance rent & a Guarantor.
    To answer your question the AST is unlikely to provide details of the specific dep protection scheme info as no DPS account can be created for a specific T until the deposit has been received and paid in to scheme Thus the LL should provide T with reqd info once this has occurred. Short term <3 yr term AST can be verbal only.

    I am beginning to wonder if this OP is genuinly seeking advice or academic researcher

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      #17
      Six months' rent and a guarantor? Are they holding your children hostage too?

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        #18
        Believe me I am genuine, want to sign the contract but really need advice whether it is acceptable terms, or whether I have the right to ask to change things. This is all completely new to me and to be honest a bit scary because once I have signed that is it.

        I didn't realise it may be best to put all of the info in to one post/thread, there are many factors to this contract and tenancy and I've been dealing with each one seperatley to help me to find out the legal perspective on each one, where I stand and can then pull all that info together to see overall where I stand and what kind of position I am in.

        I would like to negotiate, I wasn't sure if able to, if it is normal to do this or what is expected of a tenant when signing, whether I am expected to just sign or bog off? I do want to be happy with the terms though and know where I will stand once I have signed.

        For me it is better to be able to see where I stand on each part of the contract as I am looking at it but as I say this is all completely new to me.

        I guess you guys have been looking at these kind of things for years which is why I am here It really is helping me to see how the process and legal issues work so I can make a decision on this contract.

        I've gone into this not knowing what I am or not allowed to do or what I can ask for or what is normal in this process.

        (Edit - just thought also it might be good for others coming here looking for the same info to be able to be able to read individual advice on each sepearate issue) Cheers for the info on the deposit protection, seems normal then.

        Comment


          #19
          Three threads relating to the same tenancy have been merged, there may be confusion due to some overlap, but at least all related info in in one place now.

          Originally posted by meekly View Post
          (Edit - just thought also it might be good for others coming here looking for the same info to be able to be able to read individual advice on each sepearate issue)
          At the price of people trying to help you getting frustrated by multiple threads and distributed but related information.
          I also post as Mars_Mug when not moderating

          Comment


            #20
            You are free to negotiate; I think it's unlikely the LL will agree to give up a right of access to conduct viewings in the final months of the tenancy, but he may agree to remove the bit about viewings if the property is marketed for sale.

            One thing you should insist on is that the contract says rent is payable monthly in advance; even if you agree to pay 6x installments up front. There are two reasons for this:

            1) in the unlikely event that the tenancy ended sooner than six months*, any rent payable and paid in advance will not be refundable. Whereas if it's not actually payable yet, but you've paid it, then it's refundable.

            2) if the tenancy becomes periodic after the fixed term expires (this will happen automatically if you're in occupation at fixed term expiry), then the length of the tenancy periods is determined by the frequency with which rent is payable; and you don't want a tenancy with six-month periods, (as this would mean rent would continue to be payable in six-month chunks, and if you wanted to give notice to quit, it could only expire at the end of a six-month tenancy period).

            *It's very unlikely the tenancy would end earlier than six months into the tenancy. Firstly, LL can't obtain a possession order under s.21 (the 'standard' procedure) earlier than six months into the tenancy or before the end of the fixed term.

            Secondly, the alternative, proceedings under s.8, requires LL to cite grounds for seeking possession. Usually, this is unpaid rent (which obviously wouldn't apply to you); the other grounds are also unlikely to apply (e.g. other breaches of the tenancy contract, etc). But, in the event that there was a valid ground under s.8, then - worst case scenario - it'd take several months for the legal proceedings from serving notice to a bailiff knocking on the door. So basically, unless the LL served notice under s.8 in the first month of the tenancy it's unlikely you'd be evicted before the first six months were up.

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              #21
              Thanks everyone for replies, this is helping me loads to understand it all!

              Westminister - the contract says "per calander month" after the amount, so "payable monthly in advance" would be better than this for me? I shall ask for this if so.

              Should I be at all concerned that the property was on the market for sale with a for sale sign when I initially viewed the property? This concerned me at the time but was reassured when the letting Agent said it would be taken off the market when I sign the contract. I'm guessing it could go straight back on the market though once I'm in yes?

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by mariner View Post
                Personally I would not raise the issue of viewings until the situation arises, sets wrong tone from outset.
                You don't think would be best to broach this prior to the contract being signed so it is clear? I was thinking of asking to have it clarified in writing that viewings or any access by landlord person/s acting for them would be only be acceptable while I was in, during last two months of tenancy only and then 2/3 monthly checks on property on mutually prearranged time when I will be in. Also that they don't just go ahead and access the property simply because they have notified me they are coming and they will not go ahead if I have not responded as this will only be because I haven't recieved the message.

                I do fully intend to be there for the viewings but will need to arrange them so if the agent/LL contacts me at an agreed time prior to I will arrange a mutually agreeable time that I can be there.

                Basically I don't wish for anyone to access while I am out, but I will do my utmost to ensure I will be in when prearranged (only not being there in emergency or unforseeable event and that they just don't go ahead and let themselves in) would this be reasonable?

                How can I best word this or put it to the landlord. I don't want to be difficult and will allow access when I can be present and will arrange this with them when they contact during the last two months for viewings/necessary work according to contract/and 2/3 monthly checks.

                I wonder if anyone has covered this in a contract before, the wording would be handy and I could ask for it to be added before I sign?

                I was thinking of asking for this, but if they do not wish to agree then they will wish to access while I am out, and/or throughout the contract which I really wouldn't be happy with so knowing it would be an issue during the tenancy just not go ahead. Prior to the initial viewing I made, on seeing the property was for up for sale the agent did say the property would be off the market for the first 4 months of the contract, hence no viewings at all if I went ahead.

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by meekly View Post
                  Westminister - the contract says "per calander month" after the amount, so "payable monthly in advance" would be better than this for me? I shall ask for this if so.
                  In my opinion, the wording already has the same effect as Westminster was suggesting, but I am sure she will clarify.

                  Should I be at all concerned that the property was on the market for sale with a for sale sign when I initially viewed the property? This concerned me at the time but was reassured when the letting Agent said it would be taken off the market when I sign the contract. I'm guessing it could go straight back on the market though once I'm in yes?
                  I think it depends on your own plans - it suggests to me that the landlord does not really want to be renting the property, and would rather it be sold. In which case (although your tenancy would transfer to the new owner) you may not be in for a very long stay at this property as the only guarantee you have is for the fixed term you are now signing up for.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by meekly View Post
                    Westminister - the contract says "per calander month" after the amount, so "payable monthly in advance" would be better than this for me? I shall ask for this if so.
                    What's important is that it says the rent is payable monthly, or that it's payable/due on the Xth of every month, or something to that effect. It doesn't have to be the exact wording I used (and it doesn't matter whether it says in advance or not). Sometimes a contract will say that rent is, for example, £12,000 per annum, payable in advance of the Xth of the month. The '£12,000 per annum' bit is saying how the rent is calculated, not when it is payable.

                    Should I be at all concerned that the property was on the market for sale with a for sale sign when I initially viewed the property? This concerned me at the time but was reassured when the letting Agent said it would be taken off the market when I sign the contract. I'm guessing it could go straight back on the market though once I'm in yes?
                    Yes, it's possible, but if the LL sold the property during your tenancy, your tenancy would continue exactly as before, except with the new owner as your new landlord. You wouldn't have to sign a new contract with the new landlord.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by meekly View Post
                      You don't think would be best to broach this prior to the contract being signed so it is clear? I was thinking of asking to have it clarified in writing that viewings or any access by landlord person/s acting for them would be only be acceptable while I was in, during last two months of tenancy only and then 2/3 monthly checks on property on mutually prearranged time when I will be in.
                      If it were me I'd want the clause about viewings at any time during the tenancy if the property is marketed for sale removed, and I think inspections every two months is far too frequent. I inspect once every six months at most.

                      Also that they don't just go ahead and access the property simply because they have notified me they are coming and they will not go ahead if I have not responded as this will only be because I haven't recieved the message.

                      I do fully intend to be there for the viewings but will need to arrange them so if the agent/LL contacts me at an agreed time prior to I will arrange a mutually agreeable time that I can be there.

                      Basically I don't wish for anyone to access while I am out, but I will do my utmost to ensure I will be in when prearranged (only not being there in emergency or unforseeable event and that they just don't go ahead and let themselves in) would this be reasonable?
                      Whatever it says in the contract, you have the right to 'quiet enjoyment' (which means enjoying exclusive possession without interference from the LL). I don't think it's likely that the agent will agree to draft such specific details as you propose into the right of access for viewings clause, but (because of your right to enjoyment) the clause as it stands doesn't entitle the LL to enter repeatedly at any hour of the day or night without your consent. His right of access is qualified by your competing right to quiet enjoyment. When the time comes, all you have to do is write to the agent before viewings commence, setting out your terms of access. If the agent then ignored this, you'd be within your rights to change the lock as previously discussed.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
                        I think it depends on your own plans - it suggests to me that the landlord does not really want to be renting the property, and would rather it be sold. In which case (although your tenancy would transfer to the new owner) you may not be in for a very long stay at this property as the only guarantee you have is for the fixed term you are now signing up for.
                        Yes I did get the feeling the LL would rather sell, it took some time for them to come back to the agent to confirm that they wished to let it after I put my holding fee down. Then with the wording regarding viewings at any time in contract it kind of confirmed it.I'd been waiting couple of weeks or so to hear back the LL agreed to let it, I was also the first viewer, I guess I need to be sure I would be happy to move again in 6 months as it seems it could be quite likely.

                        Yes I need to consider this....

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by westminster View Post
                          If it were me I'd want the clause about viewings at any time during the tenancy if the property is marketed for sale removed, and I think inspections every two months is far too frequent. I inspect once every six months at most.


                          Whatever it says in the contract, you have the right to 'quiet enjoyment' (which means enjoying exclusive possession without interference from the LL). I don't think it's likely that the agent will agree to draft such specific details as you propose into the right of access for viewings clause, but (because of your right to enjoyment) the clause as it stands doesn't entitle the LL to enter repeatedly at any hour of the day or night without your consent. His right of access is qualified by your competing right to quiet enjoyment. When the time comes, all you have to do is write to the agent before viewings commence, setting out your terms of access. If the agent then ignored this, you'd be within your rights to change the lock as previously discussed.
                          Yes! I totally agree with all this, I would like to put my wishes to the landlord though, most of all stipulate that access only when I can be there, that I let them in, no access whle I am out except in emergency to see how they respond before I go ahead just to see whether they would be happy, as, if they are not I would then think they would just likely to go ahead and gain access anyway while I am out regardless of my wishes and I could be none the wiser, it would give me an idea of their intentions/thinking, so not the LL/property for me as don't wish for any disputes, just quiet enjoyment

                          Would no access while I am out, only on consent and when preaaranged for when I can be in, so no letting themselves in at all be deemed unreasonable? Do tenants often ask for this? Would I likely get a bad/no reference for this? It's the letting themselves in part that bothers me most. I really don't like the idea too much that they will let themselves in at any time during the viewing period, simply because they have prewarned me.

                          Also with the agent saying it would come off the market hence no viewings for sale viewings, if they don't agree now to no viewings for the first 4 months then it does mean they misled me somewhat. I will ask for that part to be removed. It would also mean that nearer the time for viewings after 4 months I would know my working hours and could give them specific times I can be in.

                          I do wonder which is the over riding and strongest law - the Tenancy agreement when signed or the Housing Act?? Does the Housing Act trump the tenancy agreement?

                          Are there test cases to look at that have challenged this in court, would anyone know where they can be viewed?

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Legislation ALWAYS trumps contract!

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Can I just ask, do you guys use a letting agency? Or private rent? I have to say you all seem very fair amd reasonable, I wonder whether I may be better off looking for another house/landlord with more agreeable terms, I wonder if this contract includes terms of a normal expectation among letting agents? Or would it be the landlord dediding the terms?

                              I know people who have private rented who have had no viewings during the contract, only after they have moved at the end of the tenancy.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                I think you will find the forum is pretty split between agent and 'go it alone'.

                                Agents should allow the landlord to specify whatever he wants in the contract, but it is easier for them if all the contracts are identical, so tha is what they try and push on the landlord.

                                We always tell newbie landlords to be very careful when selecting a letting agent (YOU could become one tommorrow - no experience or qualifications!). I guess the same applies to tenants. If you know someone who is happy in their rented home, and happy with the service they get from their landlords agent, then it is likely they will offer the same service to you.

                                Personally, I would prefer to go-it-alone, but I live 300 miles from my rental property So I do have an agent, a carefully selected one who happens to be a member of this forum!

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