Tenant obstructing selling of house

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    Tenant obstructing selling of house

    I'm a landlord and have had the same, very good tenants renting my property for nearly 3 years.
    I have served 3 months notice notice (Section 21) through my Management Company for them to leave the property at the end of November 2010.
    I have since put the house up for sale, having complied with all the guidance from the Management Company regarding notice and marketing the property etc.
    But the tenants are now being difficult, refusing to have a For Sale sign up outside the house and are refusing the estate agents and potential viewers access to the house, even though all appointments are arranged through the management company with at least 24 hours notice.
    The tenants are making out they know nothing about the house being for sale!

    Where do I stand as landlord about having the right to sell my property? And what are the responsibilities of the Management Company in this kind of situation?

    #2
    You have every right to sell our property.

    Your tenants have every right to live in their home without interuption.

    If you google for the phrase 'quiet enjoyment' - or even just search on this forum - you will discover that your tenant has no obligation to allow you, your agents or potential purchasers in the property because while they have a tenancy, they have exclusive occupation rights. That right includes any external areas covered by the tenancy agreement - hence their ability to refuse the 'for sale' board.

    If you have such an obligation in your tenancy agreement you could try and get a court order to make the tenant comply.

    You are aware that your tenants are under no obligation whatsoever to leave at the expiry date of your s21 aren't you?

    If you want agents/viewers to see inside the property, you have 2 options...
    1. Wait until you have vacant possession
    2. Negotiate / Bribe the tenant (20% off rent until sold?)

    You can sell the property with the tenant still living there, their tenancy will be unaffected.

    Comment


      #3
      wot r my rights etc

      Originally posted by Panda View Post
      I'm a landlord and have had the same, very good tenants renting my property for nearly 3 years.
      I have served 3 months notice notice (Section 21) through my Management Company for them to leave the property at the end of November 2010.
      I have since put the house up for sale, having complied with all the guidance from the Management Company regarding notice and marketing the property etc.
      But the tenants are now being difficult, refusing to have a For Sale sign up outside the house and are refusing the estate agents and potential viewers access to the house, even though all appointments are arranged through the management company with at least 24 hours notice.
      The tenants are making out they know nothing about the house being for sale!

      Where do I stand as landlord about having the right to sell my property? And what are the responsibilities of the Management Company in this kind of situation?
      I suggest you ring up the tenants yourself and ask if you can pop round to see them; and listen as sympathetically as possible to the tenants dismay etc at having to leave; and then explain that you similarly need to sell, and that they are obliged under the tenancy agreement to allow a board to be fixed for marketing and are obliged upon reasonable notice beforehand to provide access for viewings.

      I think you need to explain that in order to give a fully satisfactory reference they would need to allow you a board and access for viewings. I think it would be inflammatory to say if you don't you wont get your deposit back but clearly the deposit is not merely a security against non payment of rent; there can be other non - monetary breaches. But I suggest avoiding the murky waters of that entire issue.

      In reality if they still refuse to allow viewings and a board I dont think there's anything you can do. It's not really worth the expense of an injunction; but I think you would be granted one. It could cost a couple of thousand quid or even more to go to court; do you really need the aggro of litigation?


      I suspect with goodwill you will reach a compromise such as appointments only on a saturday morning or something like that.

      Dont worry about it if you cant reach agreement on a board.

      Globrix and Rightmove are the first point of call for any house buyer; and a well photographed property operates as its own board.

      In fact as a seller I have always resisted boards, unless selling by auction as buyers like to feel they have "found" something.

      Of course the other outcome that just might arise out of going to see the tenants is that they would like to have a stab at raising the money to buy the house. Stranger things have happened.

      Buyers especially younger ones sometimes look at properties very superficially and your tenants may have the place cluttered and a bit worn here and there. You might actually do better waiting by having an opportunity to give the place a good clean and a touch up here and there before letting potential buyers over the place.

      Comment


        #4
        It is not fair to ask tenants to allow viewings at any time with 24hr notice anyway. How would you like to have to keep tidying / cleaning - especially when there is no benefit to you personally (quite the opposite!). Please try to see it from their point of view (and I speak as a LL)
        Try to agree with the tenants a day/time when they are prepared to show people round (say 2-4 on Saturday). Inform them at least a day before if there are going to be any viewings. And you don't need a for sale board.
        Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Panda View Post
          I have served 3 months notice notice (Section 21)
          Why? The Notice period under s.21 is two months (plus, if s.21(4)(a) applies, up to & inc. an SPT period end).
          JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
          1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
          2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
          3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
          4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
            Why? The Notice period under s.21 is two months (plus, if s.21(4)(a) applies, up to & inc. an SPT period end).
            As long as OP has given at least two months' notice, correctly served, to expire at a rental period end, I cannot see that it matters a whit or a jot that they have given more than the statutory minimum. What is your point, please?
            'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
              As long as OP has given at least two months' notice, correctly served, to expire at a rental period end, I cannot see that it matters a whit or a jot that they have given more than the statutory minimum. What is your point, please?
              Because Panda appears to think that three months' Notice is needed; and I'm concerned that this is wrong (if it's an AST)- so much else may be too.
              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

              Comment


                #8
                I have had this problem with my tenants, difference being they new it was on the market before moving in, they havent been paying rent or good tenants at all. But due to 2 viewings being denied from the tenants the estate agent has taken our house of the market till they go!
                And i dont know for your ast agreement but it does say in mine that they have to allow for sale/rent sign to be put up. Maybe make sure yours doesnt say it?

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Siany88 View Post
                  I
                  And i dont know for your ast agreement but it does say in mine that they have to allow for sale/rent sign to be put up. Maybe make sure yours doesnt say it?
                  It is an unenforceable clause: All tenant has to do is politely, and calmly, decline all requests for viewings. He may even change the locks, as long as he puts the original back when he leaves.

                  You want to be able to exercise your legal rights (eg to sell house with T living there..). Why shouldn't T exercise his legal rights also (eg no visits from anyone, Landlord, agent, buyers, repairman...)

                  Cheers!

                  Artful
                  I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                    Why? The Notice period under s.21 is two months (plus, if s.21(4)(a) applies, up to & inc. an SPT period end).
                    The management company told me I could only market my house once I'd given notice to the tenants. So in order to get the ball rolling on the sale front, I gave the tenants extra notice than was actually required.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Siany88 View Post
                      And i dont know for your ast agreement but it does say in mine that they have to allow for sale/rent sign to be put up. Maybe make sure yours doesnt say it?
                      At least you have an agrrement in your hands. By signing the day to day management of my house over to a management company, I have not even seen a copy of the contact/agreement or inventory of my house!! So I don't know whether I am allowed a for sale sign or whether the tenants have to allow people to view the house while they're still living there!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Oh dear Panda - it doesn't matter what the AST says they dont HAVE TO allow viewings. Pls search for info here.
                        Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

                        Comment


                          #13
                          It is an unenforceable clause: All tenant has to do is politely, and calmly, decline all requests for viewings.

                          I didnt say anything about viewings just having a for sale sign up or rent sign on the property. And speaking from experience a contract stands for nothing, none of it can be enforced...getting rent, property being looked after etc.

                          CHEERS

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Panda View Post
                            The management company told me I could only market my house once I'd given notice to the tenants. So in order to get the ball rolling on the sale front, I gave the tenants extra notice than was actually required.
                            So the Mgt. Co. is wrong. You can market the house whenever you wish BUT:
                            a. neither you nor Estate Agents nor P can force access, even for mere viewing; and
                            b. any sale is of the house as tenanted property.
                            JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                            1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                            2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                            3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                            4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                            Comment

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