L served Notice soon after T spent on improvements

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    #31
    fair enough - I can only wish you luck and say that I think what you LL has done is not nice at all - I would not do it, certainly. Pity you are not in the lovely North!
    Unshackled by the chains of idle vanity, A modest manatee, that's me

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      #32
      Well thanks to you all for your comments. Island Girl I'm not in the North but am from the North, moved 23 years ago!!
      We have now been in our new home nearly 5 weeks, we completed the check out of the last house on 4th August, comments were that the house was left in a substantially better condition than at check in.
      Check out was done by an external company, same person who did the check in-she was amazed at the circumstances.

      To answer a re-letting question, our previous LL is not able to relet as this is a condition of the grant we were allowed for Cavity Wall Insulation, Loft insulation etc. We didnt know this was a condition but apparently not allowed to relet for 12 months. We had this done to someone elses property as we were under the false impression we were there for ever - or why would we? It was our home.

      Anyway, nothing has happened with the last house yet, we were advised at check out that there was no reason to withold any money, yesterday we got the whole amount returned minus check out charge of £111.63.
      It isn't written anywhere that this would be the amount to pay, seems an awful lot to pay and have asked the agents for a detailed explanation.

      Another question is I know the LL has every right to ask for his property back without giving a reason, but has he the right to ask us to leave because he wants to sell.
      I know its done with now, but I'm still curious as to what he's going to do. Neighbour tells me no one has been there to do anything, strange!!

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        #33
        L does have the right to recover possession, within the law, so it's immaterial whether or not he provides a reason [s.21].
        JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
        1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
        2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
        3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
        4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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          #34
          Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
          L does have the right to recover possession, within the law, so it's immaterial whether or not he provides a reason [s.21].
          But that wasn't the question, Ive said that yes I understand he has every right to recover possession and I understand he doesn't have to give a reason(S.21).

          The question was whether or not he can recover possession because he's suddenly decided he wants to sell.
          I'm sure that the T & C of an AST is that he can't.

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            #35
            Originally posted by red_jude View Post
            But that wasn't the question, Ive said that yes I understand he has every right to recover possession and I understand he doesn't have to give a reason(S.21).

            The question was whether or not he can recover possession because he's suddenly decided he wants to sell.
            Yes, landlord can get possession for whatever reason spurs him into the process. Because he doesn't have to give a reason to the tenant, or to the court if it gets that far, you may never find out what was behind it all.

            You say
            "I'm sure that the T & C of an AST is that he can't."

            - that's surprising, can you give us the exact wording of your (former) AST?

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              #36
              'might be recovered under Ground 1 Schedule 2, that is that the LL used to live in the property as his main home or intends to occupy as his main home.'

              Probably reading something into nothing as it makes no difference anymore.

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                #37
                Originally posted by red_jude View Post
                'might be recovered under Ground 1 Schedule 2, that is that the LL used to live in the property as his main home or intends to occupy as his main home.'

                Probably reading something into nothing as it makes no difference anymore.
                That clause enables L to seek possession on ground 1 [under the s.8 procedure]. I agree that 'sale' is not what it contemplates, but then L's intention is irrelevant to g1's first leg; as long as L used to live in the property as his main home (i.e. L was previously owner-occupier of the premises), L can use g1's first leg and is entitled to mandatory possession on g1 at the end of the fixed term.

                Anyway, it's wholly irrelevant if L seeks possession under the s.21 procedure.
                JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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                  #38
                  Its all wholly irrelevant, LL or his family have never lived in the property.

                  He has far bigger and better properties than that one, his farm workers used to live there years ago but it has never been his family.

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                    #39
                    Originally posted by red_jude View Post
                    Its all wholly irrelevant, LL or his family have never lived in the property.

                    He has far bigger and better properties than that one, his farm workers used to live there years ago but it has never been his family.
                    OK. In that case, L cannot have it both ways.
                    Leg2 of g1 necessitates that L intends to occupy.
                    But L explicitly wishes to sell.
                    So L cannot use g1 at all, despite the AST Agreement's reference to it.
                    JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                    1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                    2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                    3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                    4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                      OK. In that case, L cannot have it both ways.
                      Leg2 of g1 necessitates that L intends to occupy.
                      But L explicitly wishes to sell.
                      So L cannot use g1 at all, despite the AST Agreement's reference to it.
                      Sorry but you've lost me and its all become too legal and complicated.

                      If he does intend to sell - and I can't think what else he would want to do - does this all mean he can't if he never lived there. I'm not familiar with the jargon but maybe if this goes on long enough I will be!

                      He apparently sells 2 properties from his portfolio every year but haven't discovered yet whether he has vacant possession when he does this!

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Re-read ground 1. There are two 'legs' to it.
                        Leg 1 = ground 1 Notice served before term began; leg 2 = L wants property to reside in it. Neither applies here.
                        JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                        1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                        2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                        3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                        4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Well well, going back to the beginning of this post, I suppose that was where we were given notice unexpectedly.

                          We never did find out the reasons why the LL served a S21 but had different thoughts.

                          It seems the one where I thought the LL was just a money grabbing business man was right.

                          Briefly, we decided that when we moved into the last property and deciding that we wanted to stay there, yes I know, the LL always agreed we had a long lease, we would ask the LL if we could have cavity wall insulation and loft insulation done etc - through the govt scheme, he agreed of course adding a few thousand to his property.

                          We loved the house so much we wanted to be comfortable there and made it our home.
                          6 month after that we were served with the S21, apparently a LL is not allowed to increase the rent until 12 months after the work. The house @ £750 a month has been empty for nearly 5 months, it is 12 month since the insulation work was done, guess what??

                          Described as immaculate, grieves a bit when 3 of the rooms were freshly decorated.
                          Theres only a few words describe a man like that and they are not printable, but he's worth lots and I'm not!

                          Comment


                            #43
                            You are undoubtedly right about your LL, but it is probably time to move on now. Are you living somewhere you like now?
                            'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

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                              #44
                              We are living somewhere we like, ironically for more than he is now asking for the previous property.

                              It was never about the money, we just didnt know why!

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