Section 8 countdown start - the day sent, or the day served.

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    Section 8 countdown start - the day sent, or the day served.

    I've always dated section 8 notices to the day I sent them, meaning that the 14 day count down until you can send off the court papers also begins on the day sent. This method has not caused me a problem thus far. However when discussing this with someone else today, they insisted that the notice had to be dated (and the countdown begin) from the served date rather than the sent date. I send notices by first class post, so that would mean I would have to post-date them by 2 days to ensure the notice started on the official service date (i.e. 2 days after postage).

    Who is right? Me with my dating to the postagedate, or the the other chap wsuggesting the postdating to the service date?

    #2
    The Act says "...date of service..."; so the argument is really 'On what date is it served: posting or receipt?'
    JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
    1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
    2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
    3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
    4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
      The Act says "...date of service..."; so the argument is really 'On what date is it served: posting or receipt?'
      Logic suggests that 'date of service' means the date it can reasonably be expected to land in the place where the T is (or at least where you are authorised to serve him notices). If you are going to press it into T's hands in person, or even post it through his door yourself (with appropriate proof), then it is reasonable to date it for the same day. Otherwise (it if using Royal Mail), you could date it the day you post it second class, from the Outer Hebrides, but the T might not receive it through his door for up to a week afterwards.

      Common sense suggests LL should use guaranteed next day delivery if urgent, or first class and allow 3 days for postage and that 'the other chap' is thus correct, not you.
      'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

      Comment


        #4
        I suspect that, as the Notice may be a precursor to litigation, the answer lies in the Civil Procedure Rules (CPR).
        JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
        1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
        2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
        3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
        4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
          I suspect that, as the Notice may be a precursor to litigation, the answer lies in the Civil Procedure Rules (CPR).
          And are you able to gaze into the murky depths of the CPR and reveal the answer, O Great One?

          Pretty please?
          'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
            ... 'the other chap' is thus correct, not you.
            I think you're right. Lucky I have had judges who didn't notice this!

            BTW A notice (or anything else) sent by first class post is considered in law to be delivered 2 days after sending. No account is made for weekends, bank hols etc.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
              And are you able to gaze into the murky depths of the CPR and reveal the answer?
              No, unfortunately. I do not use or know anything about them. They relate to litigation minutiae. Other members may do, however, so either:
              a. await them; or
              b. read the CPR yourself: http://www.justice.gov.uk/civil/procrules_fin/
              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                No, unfortunately. I do not use or know anything about them. They relate to litigation minutiae. Other members may do, however, so either:
                a. await them; or
                b. read the CPR yourself: http://www.justice.gov.uk/civil/procrules_fin/
                Hmmm. Hard choice. Watch 'Star Trek', or read the CPR rules?

                Actually, having glanced at the link, I think I might need the other sort of CPR to revive me if I started on them in earnest.
                'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

                Comment


                  #9
                  Boldly go for it!
                  JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                  1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                  2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                  3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                  4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hello All. This is my first post.

                    If there is an issue with service of the s8 notice then the Court will indeed consider the CPR when looking at service of the s8 notice, but one must first look at the tenancy agreement, as when considering if there has been good service of the notice, the court will expect service at the contracually agreed address AND by the contractually agreed method, ie by recorded delivery.

                    That said, it is always wise to send by recorded delivery, with evidence of posting by this method, even if there is no clause in the agreement, if it means you are closer to ensuring your mandatory possession.

                    The date of service would be interpreted as the date of deemed service by ordinary first class post, which in accordance with CPR 6 is the second day after posting, there being one clear day in between. If the deemed date of service falls on a weekend or a Bank Holiday then note that the date DOES become the next working day.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Bertie Wooster View Post
                      it is always wise to send by recorded delivery, with evidence of posting by this method.
                      Hi BW - the oft quoted 'serving advice' given on this site - and used successfully in loads of cases - is to send 2 separate copies by 1st class post from 2 different post offices, obtaining free certificate of posting. The notices will be accepted by the judge as having been received the following business day.

                      The advice is also to avoid 'signed for' services because the tenant can refuse them (or not collect them) and thus delay service, possibly de-railing a possession claim for a further month.

                      Obviously the first is not in line with CPR, would you have any comments re it's apparant acceptability/success?

                      Comment


                        #12
                        The last S8 I issued was posted on the 20th but dated for service as the
                        22nd to allow 2 days for postal delivery. The tenant received it on the 21st.

                        Question 3 on the tenant's N11r defence form is, when did you receive the notice?

                        The judge didn't spot that the tenant had received the notice the day before it was served but could it have caused a problem?

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Surely post-dating notices is wrong. Notices should be dated the day they are sent. It also seems unwise to post-date a notice as there will surely be a presumption, if served by post, that the notice is not served on the day it is dated. In any event no statutory notice requires an exact period of notice so post-dating is pretty pointless.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            This was the first time I have post dated a S8. I have in the past always dated them the day they were posted, but I read on this site that it should be done this way. Perhaps I misunderstood.

                            I won't be doing it again as I was just waiting for the judge to mention it.

                            Comment

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