neighbours clashing

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    neighbours clashing

    Hi. I wonder if someone can point me in the right direction. I am a landlord of a middle flat in a block of 3. The owner of the groundfloor flat has fallen out with my tenant and the tenant from the top flat has sided with her. The landlady of the top flat says that this is the her 4th tenant in 12 months and all have left because of my tenant.
    My tenant pays regularly through the social housing and I get on alright with her. The police have been involved in incidents. I do not want to get involved, but seem to be getting dragged in.
    What I would like to know is: Am I responsible for the tenants action? The other 2 flats want me to evict her, can they make me do that? If i do that can she refuse not to go?

    #2
    Originally posted by abs View Post
    Am I responsible for the tenants action? The other 2 flats want me to evict her, can they make me do that? If i do that can she refuse not to go?
    Your tenant has to abide by the same clauses in your lease, the same as if you were living there. e.g. Not to play music between 11pm and 7:30 am etc etc etc. Also the various Landlord and tenants acts allows other owners to a peaceful and quiet residency.

    You are responsible for not breaching the lease, and to make sure your visitors / tenants etc abide by the lease ( Your headlease, as it is called )

    "want me to evict her, can they make me do that?". They can evict you, if they have the time and money for you not abiding with the conditions of the lease ( Rare, but it has been known ).

    "If i do evict, can she refuse not to go?" of course, but then it's up to you to show just cause. You have many posts on here on which forms to use, subject to your Assured shorthold tenancy agreement.

    You are not being dagged in, it's your responsiblity to obseve the lease / ensure your neighbours peaceful and quiet residency.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by ram View Post
      Your tenant has to abide by the same clauses in your lease, the same as if you were living there. e.g. Not to play music between 11pm and 7:30 am etc etc etc. Also the various Landlord and tenants acts allows other owners to a peaceful and quiet residency.
      ...but only if OP embodied (in the AST Agreement) an obligation binding T to do so.
      JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
      1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
      2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
      3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
      4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
        ...but only if OP embodied (in the AST Agreement) an obligation binding T to do so.
        Of course.
        Even the free ast's usualy found in the internet contain wording such as

        ** "Not to do or permit or suffer to be done in or on the Property any act or thing which may be a nuisance damage or annoyance to the Landlord or to the occupiers of the neighbouring premises, or which may void any insurance of the Property or cause the premiums to increase" **

        The landlord should put himslf in the possition of his tenant and say, If he ( The landlord, living in the flat ) acted in such a manner as his tenant, with police coming round, and whatever else his tenant has done, would there be complaints about him ?

        answer = Probably yes.

        If you are stating that if there is no mention of "upseting the neighbours" or anything to that efect in an ast, that tenants are free to upset neighbours ? and can have the police coming round every week ?

        i think not.
        But to stop the neighbours from suing the tenant or landlord for breach of the peace or whatever they would have to do to enjoy "peaceful and quiet residency" the landlord SHOULD ensure it does not get to that stage.

        Food for thought.

        Comment


          #5
          It's always best, when sub-letting a leasehold property (or the occasional freehold-subject-to-covenants property), for L:
          a. to provide T with a copy of the Lease/Assignment/Conveyance/Transfer that created the covenants; and
          b. to include in the Letting Agreement an explicit obligation on T to observe and perform those covenants (positive and negative) except so far as requiring payment of money.
          JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
          1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
          2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
          3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
          4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

          Comment


            #6
            A resonable clause in an AST could read :- ( and should be insisted on inclusion )

            "Perform and observe all valid obligations, a copy of which has been provided to the tenant of any headlease or covenant on the property save for those relating to the payment of rent or service charges and to refund to the landlord all reasonable costs resulting from all claims, damages, costs, charges and expenses whatsoever in relation to any breach of this obligation."

            Of course you have to let the tenant have a copy of the headlease or of the pertanent pages and highlighted ( ours is 21 pages long ).

            for those new here, pay rent or service charges ( not to ) is aimed at the owner of the flat / house who has to pay rent ( usualy ground rent ) and service charges, therefore the tenant with an AST does not have to pay these charges if the owner sub lets. ( the owner pays )

            Comment


              #7
              Better as follows:
              "(1) To observe and perform all covenants on L's part (except for any imposing payment obligations) contained mentioned or incorporated in a [Lease/Conveyance/etc.] dated [xxx] of which L has provided T with a certified copy
              (2) To indemnify L against all costs claims and demands arising from any breach of this obligation."
              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

              Comment


                #8
                Thank you for your help.Ram and Jeffery

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by abs View Post
                  Thank you for your help.Ram and Jeffery
                  Our pleasure.

                  Advice was probably not what you wanted to hear, as you initialy said "I do not want to get involved".

                  Jeffery is knowledgeable in legal matters and brief and I tend to explain in laymans terms,/ logic and in length sometimes. I am not pro Landlord, and neither am I pro tenant.

                  We hope you may have looked at your obligations in a new / better light, and to process any problems with a degree of urgency, which makes life better and more peaceful in the long run.

                  Comment

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