Help to get deposit back please

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    Help to get deposit back please

    Hi 1st post here,

    I am here asking for help on behalf of a family member.

    Its been near on 6 months since she left the property with her friend.

    Find below all the emails from her friend to the Landlord.

    All names removed.

    Starting with the 1st to last one in December, and I believe 3 other emails since with no reply.

    I also notice that she has not received "deposit protection paperwork" although asked for.

    The falt was left in an immaculate condition, they have had no invoice for any costs that may have occurred.

    Here we go

    Them to Landlord

    Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    Hi XXX

    Did you manage to get that information on our deposit in the deposit protection scheme?

    Thank you

    Regards,

    XXXXX

    -----------------------------------------------------
    LandLord to them

    Subject: Re:
    Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009

    XXXX

    Its the XXXXX --- XXXXXXXX- XXXXXX deposit scheme and its with Dispute services.

    As mentioned, its business as normal - so please have no concern even though it all sounds rather official.

    Regards

    XXXXX

    --------------------------------------------------------

    Them to LL

    Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    XXXXX

    Thank you for your time last week, it was greatly appreciated.

    However, my flat mate brought to my attention yesterday another letter from Wragge & co regarding the court case on Friday 7th August 2009.

    I gave XXXXXX a call and she quite abruptly told me that the court case is still going ahead on the 7th August.

    It was mine and my flat mate's understanding that it was all sorted. Can you shed any light on the matter?

    Thank you in advance for your time and co-operation,

    With Regards,

    XXXXXX

    --------------------------------------------------------
    LL to Them

    Subject: Re:
    Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009

    XXXXXX

    Please be assured all is ok. I have come to an agreement with my mortgage provider Birmingham Midshires to pay an agreed amount every month - all the hearing is about is to cement this by way of a legal charge and possibly a suspended order which means that I will need to maintain payments, which obviously I will.

    I would assure you that I am a responsible landlord owning 30 properties, and although like most , have been affected by the downturn am still holding my own.

    Regards

    xxxxxxxxx

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Them to LL


    Sent: Sunday, August 02, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    Thank you for being reassuring in your last email. XXXX and I still feel a little uncertain in the current situation we're in. We have spoken to citizens advice and they have advised us to delay the rent payment until; after the court date confirms what you have agreed with your mortage provider and to request asap our deposit protection scheme details in writing due to not receiving them in writing in March within the 14 day time bracket.

    Thank you for your continued time and co-operation

    Regards

    XXXXX & XXXXXX


    -------------------------------------------------------------------




    LL to Them


    Subject: Re:
    Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2009

    s xxxxxxxx

    I note your email - however without your rent I cannot make my mortgage payments and if this is the case Birmingham Midshire will take repossesion action without doubt.

    The reason the mortgage arrears amounted was that I was without a tenant for 3 months late last year. Since that date I have been with tenants have have kept up to date with mortgage payments but there are arrears still.

    I would urge you to pay - you are liable to pay rent under your tenancy agreement !

    The hearing on Friday is to ensure that they seek a deffered order for repossession that they could action should I not keep up with my payments - so you see how important it is - if you do not pay then they could repossess within a month.

    regards
    xxxxxxxxxxxx


    ------------------------------------------------

    Them to LL

    Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009

    Subject: RE:


    XXXXXXXX

    Hope all is well.

    I have sent the £XXX rent for this month.

    Just a quick email to confirm that you got the letter of termination of our contract?

    Due to recent events, both my flat mate and I have decided that renting is too uncertain and un-necessary stress.

    We understand and respect that in regards to the one months notice requirements, our termination date falls short of the one month agreed in the contract by a couple of days. We understand if you wish to prolong the leaving date by a week or two but in regards to time of year we have recently been led to believe (by several letting agents) that this is the busiest time for landlords to obtain tenants.

    I wait your decision on this matter.

    Thank you for your time,

    XXXXX & XXXXXX


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

    LL to Them




    Subject: Re:
    Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2009

    xxxxxxxx
    I received your letter yesterday 12th August, although I note your letter is dated 5th

    Obviously I am dissapointed you are terminating, what I would ask is that the months notice ends 12th September as I have already lost a week in remarketing.

    However as you have been good tenants I am happy to allow you to stay if you want from month to month until you decide to vacate with 1 months notice in writing which I would accept by telephone on the day you write the letter.

    Have a think and let me know - obviously if you decide to do this, this email would suffice in varying the terms of the tenancy you signed.

    Regards

    xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Them to LL


    Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    Hi XXXXX

    XXXXX and I are both happy for our months notice to end on 12th September.

    Thank you for your time

    Regards

    XXXXXX







    LL to them

    Subject: Re:
    Date: Sat, 15 Aug 2009

    xxxxxxx

    Thanks for your confirmation -I have instucted XXXX letting agents to relet.

    I would be most grateful if you could keep Birmingham Midshires draconian proceedings(now settled) confidential and not inform XXX lettings as I have 5 other apartments in the building which they deal with and I do not want this small set back with XXXXX only to affect my relationship with them.

    Many thanks and good luck with your move



    Regards

    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Them to LL

    Sent: Wednesday, September 02,

    Subject: RE:



    Hi XXXXX

    I was asked by XXX Lettings if we could move out by the 10th September instead of the 12th as he has found new tennants that want to move in on this date and said they wouldn't be able to move in otherwise.

    I have agreed to this and said that I would get in touch with you to let you know and to sort out getting my deposit back.

    I thought I had to get the deposit back through XXXX Lettings but he informed me that I have to get it from you. He did say that you can contact him to reassure you that we have left the apartment in as good as if not better condition than when we moved in.

    My sort code is :XXXXX

    My Account Number is: XXXXXX

    Name on Account is: XXXXXXXX

    Many thanks for your time and co-operation

    Regards

    XXXXXXX










    LL To Them


    Subject: Re:
    Date: Sun, 6 Sep 2009

    xxxxxx

    Thanks for your email.

    Once all your belongings are moved out and the place cleaned, XXX lettings will inspect and report back that I can return your deposit which I shall then request from the deposit scheme.

    Thanks

    Regards

    xxxxxx

    But no paperwork to suggest it ever was.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Them to LL



    Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    Hi xxxxxx

    Can I ask what the latest is on getting our deposit back? Last I was told was it would take about 7 days.

    In case you need my bank details:

    My sort code is : xxxxxx

    My Account Number is: xxxxxxxxx

    Name on Account is: xxxxxxxxx

    Many thanks for your time and co-operation

    Regards
    xxxxxxx

    ------------------------------------------

    LL to Them



    Subject: Re:
    Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2009

    xxxxx

    I am chasing my the administrators of my deposit scheme to pay back the deposit -hopefully shouldn't be long now

    Regards


    xxxxxxxxxxxxxx


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Them to LL



    Sent: Monday, October 12, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    xxxxxxx,

    What is the latest on the desposit now?

    I'm sorry to keep on asking but it has been some time and I am having to pay rent where I am now and need the money.

    Regards,

    xxxxxxxx





    LL to them


    Subject: Re:
    Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009

    xxxxxx


    I have still not received the deposit back - I am chasing and will let you know as soon as the DPS pay it back

    Regards

    xxxxxxx

    #2
    Them to LL



    Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009

    Subject: RE:



    XXXXXX

    The deposit reimbersment is now in excess of 8 weeks. I have spoken to other people that have rented previously and each one of them has said that this is more than double the waiting time.

    My flat mate XXXXXXXXX whom was the other tennant on our contract will be conversing with her legal advisor tomorrow about this matter, as ideally we would now like this cleared up within the next 1-2 weeks.

    We can't understand why the hold up with our payment from XXXX XXXX inc XXXXX & XXXXX deposit scheme is such a lengthy one.

    I look forward to hearing from you soon.

    Regards

    xxxxxxxx





    Him to Them


    Subject: Re:
    Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009


    xxxxx

    I have chased again and am promised this will be credited back within the next 10 days

    Thanks for your patience

    Regards

    xxxxxxxx







    Them to Him





    Subject: RE: LEGAL ACTION
    Date: Tue, 15 Dec 2009

    xxxxxxx

    After numerous emails sent now regarding our deposit; which should have by law been settled within ten days of leaving the property, it is our regret that both xxxxxxxx and I will be seeking legal action unless our deposit is paid by Friday 18th December 2009.

    Regards

    xxxxxxxxx








    They never had any confirmation that the deposit was held with the protection scheme.

    He clearly said in emails it was with them.


    Is this just a case now of a Letter before action addressed to the Land Lord, and not the letting agents.

    If so do we have a template anywhere, I shall go searching now.

    Btw, they have proof of deposit been paid, bank transfer and receipt, also all rent payments were on time


    Sorry for all the posts but it would only allow me to copy an paste it so many at the time, but at least you get the full picture

    Comment


      #3
      Suggest that they just issue proceeding via MCOL: https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/csmco2/index.jsp

      Comment


        #4
        Sillyme: your posts are way too long. Please summarise your question(s).
        JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
        1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
        2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
        3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
        4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

        Comment


          #5
          Can't read through that lot, so let me ask...

          Did the tenancy start after 6/4/07?
          Do you know if the deposit was protected or not?
          What were the tenancy dates?
          When did you give written notice?
          Do you have proof LL got this notice?

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
            Can't read through that lot, so let me ask...

            Did the tenancy start after 6/4/07? YES



            Do you know if the deposit was protected or not? Checking this out as we speak, He has stated it was in the emails above, but never been given a certifcate.


            What were the tenancy dates? 6 Mth shorthold Tenancy, 6th march till 10th September


            When did you give written notice?Letter Dated the 5th of August, he received 12th of August according to his reply via email.


            Do you have proof LL got this notice?
            Confirmation given from him in Email.




            Very Sorry for the long First post, I just thought if all put up once would suffice.

            Thank you for any help here.

            Will check back in an hour or so

            Comment


              #7
              6 Mth shorthold Tenancy, 6th march till 10th September is not 6 months. Presumbly, the tenancy was 6th March to 5th September? Therefore notice letter of 12th August would give a leaving date (rent liability) of 5th November. (Had you left 5/9 there would have been no rent liability)

              Have you chased MyDeposits about your refund? I believe if the LL is not playing ball, they will refund you and then chase LL.

              If the deposit was not protected (or even if the prescribed information was not provided) you should be able to get your full deposit back through MCOL - although this would not prevent LL subsequently taking you to court for any amount that was owing (but he'd have to prove what was due).

              You will also read that you can obtain compensation of 3 x the deposit value for non-protected deposits. It is true, but more complex and financially risky.

              Comment


                #8
                6 Mth shorthold Tenancy, 6th march till 10th September is not 6 months.

                Moved out the 10th of sept, instead of the agreed date of 12th sept



                Presumbly, the tenancy was 6th March to 5th September? Therefore notice letter of 12th August would give a leaving date (rent liability) of 5th November. (Had you left 5/9 there would have been no rent liability)


                Notice letter was dated 5th August. He said he never got it till the 12th

                All agreed for September for vacating





                Have you chased MyDeposits about your refund? I believe if the LL is not playing ball, they will refund you and then chase LL.

                We are checking with the 3 agencys to see if it was protected.



                If the deposit was not protected (or even if the prescribed information was not provided) you should be able to get your full deposit back through MCOL - although this would not prevent LL subsequently taking you to court for any amount that was owing (but he'd have to prove what was due).


                Agreed that nothing was owed

                You will also read that you can obtain compensation of 3 x the deposit value for non-protected deposits. It is true, but more complex and financially risky.



                Is this really worth the risk? We would be happy just to get the deposit back

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Sillyme View Post
                  Is this really worth the risk? We would be happy just to get the deposit back
                  So issue a claim against the LL using Money Claim Online.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Should we send him a letter before action first?


                    Asking in the letter for our deposit back, and if finding that he never used a deposit protection service, state that in the letter he never complied with the law as regards deposit's, but emphasise we only want our deposit back.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      We have now confirmed with all 3 deposit agency's, that no deposit was held with any of them.


                      Would it be a good idea to now send this letter i got from another part of the forum



                      Letter Before Action

                      Dear Mr XXXXXXXX

                      RE: 123 High Street, Anytown, AT1 2AA

                      On the XXX of XXX 20XX I/We paid you a tenancy deposit of £XXX in respect of the above property.

                      The Housing Act 2004 introduced the concept of "Tenancy Deposit Protection" and obliges private landlords to protect/register all tenancy deposits with one of 3 approved schemes.

                      I/We have verified with all three schemes that the deposit you hold was NOT protected by any scheme. This is unlawful.

                      You must refund the outstanding balance of my/our deposit IN FULL within 14 days. If you fail to do so, I/we shall sue you for the balance due PLUS the statutory penalty for non-protection of deposits, which is three times the value of the deposit.

                      Yours sincerely

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Good. That sounds business-like.
                        JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                        1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                        2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                        3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                        4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                        Comment


                          #13
                          You need to decide... do you just want the deposit back, or do you want to claim for the 3x penalty too?

                          You said

                          Is this really worth the risk? We would be happy just to get the deposit back

                          but then the letter before action you quoted mentions that you will be claiming the 3x penalty for non-protection of the deposit.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by obiwan View Post
                            You need to decide... do you just want the deposit back, or do you want to claim for the 3x penalty too?

                            You said

                            Is this really worth the risk? We would be happy just to get the deposit back

                            but then the letter before action you quoted mentions that you will be claiming the 3x penalty for non-protection of the deposit.
                            Why not claim both?
                            JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                            1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                            2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                            3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                            4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                            Comment


                              #15
                              That sounds fine, though you should note that, as Snorkerz pointed out in a previous post, sueing for the 3x deposit sanction may be risky and complex, because these cases are no longer usually allocated to the small claims track, court fees are therefore much higher, you are exposed to the defendant's legal costs, and there is no guarantee you will win as the statute is open to interpretation.

                              Also, such a claim cannot be issued using Money Claim Online. See
                              http://painsmith.wordpress.com/2009/...or-tds-claims/

                              This is not to say you do not have a case for claiming the 3x sanction, only that you should seek proper legal advice before doing so, and it would be irresponsible to recommend you pursue the claim as a litigant-in-person unless you are fully conversant with the statute and multi-track procedure, and fully aware of the risks.

                              If you just want your deposit back, as you say, the simpler and easier option is to claim just for the deposit.

                              Comment

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