Is L responsible for providing heating?

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    Is L responsible for providing heating?

    Hi

    First post so please be gentle

    T has been complaining that it is cold and I looked into central heating but it was too dear. He is now saying that as LL we have a duty to provide fixed heating. All there is in at the moment is plug in electric radiator things. Is he right?

    #2
    Originally posted by chrisj_ View Post
    Hi

    First post so please be gentle

    T has been complaining that it is cold and I looked into central heating but it was too dear. He is now saying that as LL we have a duty to provide fixed heating. All there is in at the moment is plug in electric radiator things. Is he right?
    No, s11 of the Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 says you have to provide facilities for heating water and space (rooms). Your plug in heaters seem to cover that.

    I don't want to advertise on here, but if you PM me I can give you details of a company who do some rather nice 'plug in' fires for £50 - £60, including 'wood burner' style.

    Comment


      #3
      And many have economy 7 storage heaters as standard when build. You only need 1 large (possible 2 for larger) per flat. Expensive per item (if buying new) but might do the trick as a long lasting and simply to install option.

      For good practice, there are many room and radiator heating calculators out there (google). You simply enter the size of rooms and answer certain questions about how many outside walls and if it is double glazed etc. It will tell you how many KW output per room/area will be required to heat/maintain temperatures within that room/area.

      Maybe you could spreadsheet the rooms, show the output requirements from an independant site to the tenant, and then evidence that whatever heating you install covers this requirement (it might give them peace of mind).

      I remember having a good convector heater in an odl property I was living in and it was far more economical and dare I say cheaper than the central heating which I rarely used!

      Regards


      .

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by chrisj_ View Post
        T has been complaining that it is cold and I looked into central heating but it was too dear. He is now saying that as LL we have a duty to provide fixed heating. All there is in at the moment is plug in electric radiator things. Is he right?
        While you have no obligation to install central heating per se, the property must be adequately heated - 21 C is an acceptable temperature. If it's a lot less than this it may constitute a health hazard. If the tenant complains to the environmental health officer, they may require you to improve the heating provided.

        See guidance on the Health & Safety Rating System, downloadable here. Chapter 2: Excess Cold
        http://www.communities.gov.uk/public...ratingguidance

        A healthy indoor temperature is around 21°C, although cold is not generally perceived until the temperature drops below 18°C. A small risk of adverse health effects begins once the temperature falls below 19°C. Serious health risks occur below 16°C with a substantially increased risk of respiratory and cardiovascular conditions. Below 10°C the risk of hypothermia becomes appreciable, especially for the elderly.
        BTW if the tenant is on benefits/low income etc they may be entitled to a Warm Front grant. http://www.warmfront.co.uk/ You might also investigate grants for insulation etc.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
          No, s11 of the Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 says you have to provide facilities for heating water and space (rooms).
          No, it doesn't. It obliges L to keep in working repair the installations that exist; but not to provide those that don't.
          JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
          1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
          2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
          3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
          4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
            No, it doesn't. It obliges L to keep in working repair the installations that exist; but not to provide those that don't.
            Sorry OP, my info was wrong . I've told that lie to dozens of people!

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
              Sorry OP, my info was wrong. I've told that lie to dozens of people!
              How many noticed?
              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                How many noticed?
                Apparently only you, All-Seeing Eye!
                'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                  How many noticed?
                  I read a recent article about 'nonversations' - from it I gather that most people weren't even listening let alone taking notice!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
                    I read a recent article about 'nonversations' - from it I gather that most people weren't even listening let alone taking notice!
                    Not necessarily! We might have belonged to the 'Hearing, But Not Actively Listening' group or even the 'Listening, But Confused' lot.
                    'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
                      Not necessarily! We might have belonged to the 'Hearing, But Not Actively Listening' group or even the 'Listening, But Confused' lot.
                      Reminiscent of 'The Voice of the Listener and Viewer' [see http://www.vlv.org.uk/], itself a spectacular simultaneous impossibility.
                      JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                      1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                      2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                      3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                      4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Thanks a lot for the replies so far. I visited the property yesterday and the two heaters we have provided aren't even being used they have an oil filled radiator and a gas fire running off a bottle.

                        Anyway I had a letter off them the other day as T got an electric shock off the light switch in the kitchen and they have phoned the local council who are sending the housing officer round to assess the situation. They are saying it's too cold and damp. They have complained to me before about this and have found that the damp is condensation that is being caused by various factors:-

                        The roof insulation is poor
                        There is no cavity wall insulation
                        They are drying clothes on hangers in the flat
                        They are not opening any window at all
                        They are cooking large pans of pasta/rice all the time
                        There is no central heating

                        I have found a grant so that the insulation can be done for free and we are awaiting the council to do this but they will not open windows to help alleviate the problem. They think that central heating will solve this and although it may help it will not completely solve the problem. We have had a quote for this and it will be prohibitively expensive as in addition to the installation we will also have to pay national grid to get the gas piped to the house.

                        Obviously I was concerned when I had heard that T had an electric shock and I have checked it out and it was caused by excess condensation on the walls in the kitchen. So I have provided them with a dehumidifier to help rectify the problem.

                        On entering the flat yesterday it is like the amazon rainforest in there. There are no windows open and large pots of pasta/rice cooking, clothes everywhere and it was really hot. If they are not willing to listen to me regarding ventilation what can I do? Also spoke to the housing officer who said he will go and make the point when he is there if he feels appropriate.

                        Do you think I should attend when the housing officer goes?
                        Is there anything to worry about regarding the housing officers visit? (I am not overly worried about this as I feel most things are in order)

                        Comment


                          #13
                          How about installing a powerful extractor fan in the kitchen (not just in the cooker hood)? One with a humidity sensor so that it doesn't switch itself off until the humidity is reduced to 'normal' levels, i.e. tenant-proof.

                          I'd have thought this would be more effective than relying on the tenant either to open the window to let the steam out, or to actually use the dehumidifier (and keep emptying it).

                          Yes, I think you should attend when the environmental health officer visits (I assume this is who you mean).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I have considered fitting a fan and one with a humidity sensor sounds like a good idea as tenant proofing is the way to go. There is mould growng in the bedroom and front room as well though (not as bad though) which implies the whole flat is suffering.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by chrisj_ View Post
                              I have considered fitting a fan and one with a humidity sensor sounds like a good idea as tenant proofing is the way to go. There is mould growng in the bedroom and front room as well though (not as bad though) which implies the whole flat is suffering.
                              Amazing that people would rather live with mould than open the windows occasionally

                              Perhaps a vent of some kind in the bedroom/front room might be a solution. The Victorian conversion I live in used to have a vent in the masonry/exterior wall in the living room, I presume the old fashioned way to reduce condensation problems? (We blocked ours up to build a bookcase but it's okay as I do open the windows regularly).

                              Comment

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