T's wife moving in. What to do with AST?

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    T's wife moving in. What to do with AST?

    I have someone wanting to start tenancy on 6th Feb. His wife is joining him from abroad on 10th Feb. Obviously she will not be available to sign AST on 6th. I believe she should also be named on the agreement and sign it, therefore what procedure should i follow to make sure agreement is legal and correct?

    #2
    Send her a copy of the AST to sign and return before 6 Feb 2010; then, on this date Mr T and LL signs.
    The information in my posts is provided 'as is'. This is not intended to be legal advice. Legal or other professional advice should be sought before acting or relying on this information or any part of it. I will not be held responsible for loss or damage arising from errors in the information or the way in which a person uses the information on this . For more information on your query use the '' link at the top of this page. Agreements, Forms & Notices can be found .

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      #3
      Originally posted by davidm View Post
      I have someone wanting to start tenancy on 6th Feb. His wife is joining him from abroad on 10th Feb. Obviously she will not be available to sign AST on 6th. I believe she should also be named on the agreement and sign it, therefore what procedure should i follow to make sure agreement is legal and correct?
      1. An AST can be valid even if:
      a. the Counterpart is unsigned by T; or
      b. the AST is entirely oral
      (although both of these are bad ideas and store-up potential problems!)

      2. Why not grant AST to H only but, in it, allow him to authorise W to co-occupy?

      3. Alternatively:
      a. obtain W's faxed/e-mailed consent to a joint-names AST ;and
      b. grant it to them jointly (but with only H's signature on Counterpart AST, signing 'on behalf of self and W').
      JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
      1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
      2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
      3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
      4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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        #4
        Thanks for that Jeffrey. I prefer option 3.b or perhaps 2.
        For option 3.b would I actually need to have an e-mail or fax from her giving permission for this? or can the husband just sign on her behalf? It seems to be not quite right either way.

        Is it o.k , or preferable, for her to sign the agreement also when she moves in.
        Alternatively, can a new agreement be used to replace the initial one, when both are present to sign it?

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          #5
          Looking at it again I guess option 2 would be the simplest, but is it the safest?

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by davidm View Post
            Alternatively, can a new agreement be used to replace the initial one, when both are present to sign it?
            Bad idea; problems re deposit protection, for instance.
            JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
            1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
            2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
            3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
            4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

            Comment


              #7
              Following this theme - The AST agreement on our rented property is in the tenant's name only. Just before he moved in last July he told me he was getting back together with his ex wife and she was moving in. It only recently occurred to me that she shouldn't be living there full time. What should I do?

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                #8
                Originally posted by Thyrsis View Post
                Following this theme - The AST agreement on our rented property is in the tenant's name only. Just before he moved in last July he told me he was getting back together with his ex wife and she was moving in. It only recently occurred to me that she shouldn't be living there full time. What should I do?
                It doesn't have to be a problem, so long as you are happy for her to be there. Without her name on the AST she has minimal tenancy rights. However, if you want to formalise the arrangement, you can either wait until the end of the fixed term and issue new AST to H&W (refund & reprotect deposit) or before that you can ask H to assign the tenancy to H&W.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Snorkerz View Post
                  It doesn't have to be a problem, so long as you are happy for her to be there. ......
                  If I am not happy for her to be there can I (politely) ask her to leave?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Thyrsis View Post
                    If I am not happy for her to be there can I (politely) ask her to leave?
                    Okay, entering into the realms of what I think, not what I know....

                    You can certainly 'ask' her to leave, but as a guest of your tenant she might not agree.

                    I don't believe you can evict her yourself because she is in a property that you have let to someone else - ie it is an issue between H & W.

                    If your tenancy doesn't say no sub-letting, then H could become W's landlord and so all you could do is evict H as and when the opportunity arises. If H is evicted, W will also be removed by bailiffs.

                    Alternatively, if it does say no sub-letting then you could try to evict H under s8 g12 (breach of TA) but it isn't a mandatory ground. Failing that, issue s21 and evict at end of fixed term. Again, if H is evicted, W will also be removed by bailiffs.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I shouldn't worry - just let the wife move in as a long term guest of your tenant. As has been said above, if you have to evict your tenant, bailiffs will evict wife as well. I have one property where tenant's circumstances changed and she was no longer able to afford the whole rent but wanted to remain. She asked if her friend could move in (it is a two bedroom property). I agreed, rent is paid promptly and this arrangement has been going on for the last three years. Naturally, the property is immaculately maintained and I hope the arrangement continues for many more years.

                      P.P.
                      Any information given in this post is based on my personal experience as a landlord, what I have learned from this and other boards and elsewhere. It is not to be relied on. Definitive advice is only available from a Solicitor or other appropriately qualified person.

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by P.Pilcher View Post
                        I shouldn't worry - just let the wife move in as a long term guest of your tenant. As has been said above, if you have to evict your tenant, bailiffs will evict wife as well. I have one property where tenant's circumstances changed and she was no longer able to afford the whole rent but wanted to remain. She asked if her friend could move in (it is a two bedroom property). I agreed, rent is paid promptly and this arrangement has been going on for the last three years. Naturally, the property is immaculately maintained and I hope the arrangement continues for many more years.

                        P.P.
                        True, but I have some sympathy with the OP's preference for a joint tenancy in this situation. If, for example, the relationship breaks down and he leaves, leaving her in the property, he can sue her for arrears if the tenancy is joint but not if it is in the sole name of the husband.

                        Of course, the downside would be that, in this event, the wife would have the same occupancy rights as the husband and the landlord, conceivably, may be unhappy with this. In my experience, though, problems are fewer with joint than with sole tenancies in these circumstances.

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