Possession Claim On Line (PCOL)- help re procedure

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    #16
    also i served the s21 via hand directly to the tenant, not via post. do i need to fill in a N215 for pargraph 7??

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      #17
      Originally posted by vik2001 View Post
      thanks alot appreicated. im on it now.
      once i fill it in, do i wait till the expiry date as stated on the s21 before i hand this in to my local county court, or can i hand it in before the expiry date to the court, and will they except it??

      I would wait until after the expiry date, (they may surprise you and leave) you might pay out £150 court costs for no reason at all. I would personally write a letter to the tenants arranging the check out procedure and then wait and see, in the meantime have the form filled out in readiness to hand in on the next day after the expiry of the tenancy.

      or

      test Jeffries theory

      take it down the court and see if you can submit it now

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        #18
        I've never had to seek a possession order before,.. but my experience of PCOL was a good one.

        Within 12 hours of pressing 'submit' I had my court date.
        Then just turned up with all the paperwork on that date.

        The progress tracking was quite nice too, in that you can see if the defendant has filed a defence and you can also see when the judgements are raised - which happened about 14 days after the hearing for me.

        You can also select different options based on the progress of the claim, such as the various warrants or submitting additional documentation.

        Comment


          #19
          PCOL experiences

          Originally posted by albyskoons View Post

          Then just turned up with all the paperwork on that date.
          Did this mean the standard court forms or just your copies of evidence to support your claim?

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by Paul_W View Post
            Did this mean the standard court forms or just your copies of evidence to support your claim?
            When you enter the information online about the claim, it is similar to N5 form, you also need to fill out history of arrears. Then you take other documentations to court, i'e notices you served, tenancy agreement etc.

            Comment


              #21
              Does PCOL include order to pay unpaid rent

              Hello,

              I have a very awkward tenant who has refused to leave after being served a S21 that expired on wednesday. Hence I have since used the PCOL site to submit a possesion claim. My tenant currently owes me £2250 and this is stated on the PCOL entry, however and despite numerours web searches and reading I am still unsure if the court will simply grant me possesion or if they will grant possesion and an order for the tenant to pay. I would appreciate any advice on this and if it is only a possesion then what procedure I need to go through to also try and reclaim the unpaid rents.

              Thanks

              Jason

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by jasonmccaul View Post
                I have a very awkward tenant who has refused to leave after being served a S21 that expired on wednesday. Hence I have since used the PCOL site to submit a possesion claim. My tenant currently owes me £2250 and this is stated on the PCOL entry, however and despite numerours web searches and reading I am still unsure if the court will simply grant me possesion or if they will grant possesion and an order for the tenant to pay. I would appreciate any advice on this and if it is only a possesion then what procedure I need to go through to also try and reclaim the unpaid rents.
                Never used PCOL myself, but presumably it's the same as seeking possession via S21 through the normal court? And you certainly can't include a claim for money through the S21 route; you'd have to do that using a small claim -ie http://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk

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                  #23
                  If the unpaid rent represents two months or more why aren't you using the S.8 Grounds 8,10,11 route where you can have the amount owing assessed at the same time? You can't use the APP but must go the "normal" route.
                  The advice I give should not be construed as a definitive answer, and is without prejudice or liability. You are advised to consult a specialist solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    PCOL Evidence

                    I assume as part of the PCOL application I need to provide evidence of an S21 and I would also have thought I would be required to provide a copy of the tenancy agreement. The website does not seem to allow upload of attachments so I can only assume I need to post these to the court which rather defeats the object of having an 'online' service.

                    Can anyone confirm this is actually the case or if there is an alternative way of sending these. Given I dont live in the UK using post to send such documents is far from ideal.

                    Thanks

                    Jason

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Sharing my PCOL experience

                      I though I would just put down my PCOL experience as the official advice is lacking and not many people have experienced it yet.

                      When rent was 2 months in arrears I served section 8 on grounds 8, 10 and 11 (can't use PCOL for S21)
                      2 weeks later I did the PCOl application (£100)
                      I was instantly given a court date (5 weeks wait)
                      You can submit correspondence online and in writing if you need to amend anything.
                      Went to court today and 1 of the 3 defendants turned up.
                      The judge wanted to see the tenancy agreement, the copy of the section 8 and a list of arrears calculated to the hearing date.
                      I was awarded possession as of today as the dependent said no-one was living there.
                      The defendants were given a CCJ for arrears plus costs.

                      It was my first time in court but it was quite straightforward.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        It is a relative breeze if you get all your paperwork right as a landlord and you take the rent schedule up to date together with the originals of the tenancy agreement and some proofs of what has been done to try and extract the arrears.

                        I have had tenants turn up to PCOL hearings and dispute the arrears - because I had written to the tenants before the hearing and asked them to prove that my arrears schedule was incorrect in any way, the judge took my concise arrears schedule as totally accurate - in one case the judge extended the possession date to six weeks hence because the female half had recently (2 weeks before) had a baby which we were totally unaware of before the defence disputing the arrears was filed.

                        It often amazes me how tenants will blithly sit there and dispute their arrears which often run into several hundred if not thousands of £ when it is clearly obvious they have no way of avoiding a mandatory "two month arrears" possession order. I always take the line "Well, sir or madam, I wrote to the defendant tenants the day after receiving their defence and asked them to provide proof or receipts to show that they only owe £500 instead of the £2000 I allege they owe - here are copies of the two letters with receipts of posting - I regret I received no reply" - that usually dispels that defence!

                        One tenant was so thick they admitted in the defence they owed £700 on a monthly rent of £350 (they owed £2100) and at court admitted they still owed £700 - that was enough for the judge to make the mandatory PO on that admission alone - in fact the judge awarded rent arrears of the full £2100 plus costs.

                        In all cases, I make up a bundle (1 for judge, 1 for me, 1 for each defendant and possible representative and 1 spare) and hand these out - it contains a copy of the rent agreement, copy of the S8 notice, arrears schedule and the aforesaid letters and copy of the proofs of posting. It helps me, helps the judge and usually destroys arguments from the tenant defendant.

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                          #27
                          It wasn't a total breeze and was made easier by the defendants not being able to dispute the claim. The defence was, he had moved out and told the remaining tenant to give notice but the judge calmly explained that as no notice was given, he was still liable for the rent.

                          One of the worst things about the experience was not being able to get procedural information from the court or the PCOL helpline. I wasn't sure until I got there that I had to bring documents with me rather than submit in advance or if I would be awarded possession only or if the defendants would get a CCJ. I was told by the court that I was only claiming for possession and the defendants wouldn't be told to pay arrears.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            One of the best pieces of advice I can give anyone using the PCOL system is "assume nothing" and take the view that the tenant will try every ploy possible at the hearing, so you must be ready to counter every porky that the tenant or his solicitor/rep/friend/whatever tells. Have proof of rent arrears in a tabular form - Date. Rent Due. Paid. Total Arrears. Copies of bank statements if the tenant pays direct to bank also help.

                            You only need the judge to consider that there were 2 months arrears or more at the time of service of the notice, and that there are 2 months or more arrears at the court hearing date with all payments and rent charged up to the court hearing date. It does not matter if the two figures are different or whether the second is substantially lower than the first (i.e. Rent £400/pm - service S8 when arrears £1200, at court arrears are £900 - thats still over 2 months worth).

                            Remember also that the judge is the one who makes the judicial decision, not the court staff. If the judge does not automatically make an order for the arrears (in my experience they do), then ask for an order, and also ask for your costs (i.e. the court fee, time off work, travel to court, prep of papers etc.), the judge has got to allow you the court fee at least - others are discretionary.

                            The great thing about PCOL in my opinion is you are given the court date immediately rather than having to wait for the local court to allocate a hearing which used to take longer. What is quite laborious is that you have to enter the rent payments and charges into their online form and you have to be very accurate - garbage in is garbage out!!!!!!

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by davidjohnbutton View Post
                              One of the best pieces of advice I can give anyone using the PCOL system is "assume nothing" and take the view that the tenant will try every ploy possible at the hearing, so you must be ready to counter every porky that the tenant or his solicitor/rep/friend/whatever tells. Have proof of rent arrears in a tabular form - Date. Rent Due. Paid. Total Arrears. Copies of bank statements if the tenant pays direct to bank also help.

                              You only need the judge to consider that there were 2 months arrears* or more at the time of service of the notice, and that there are 2 months or more arrears* at the court hearing date with all payments and rent charged up to the court hearing date. It does not matter if the two figures are different or whether the second is substantially lower than the first (i.e. Rent £400/pm - service S8 when arrears £1200, at court arrears are £900 - thats still over 2 months worth).

                              Remember also that the judge is the one who makes the judicial decision, not the court staff. If the judge does not automatically make an order for the arrears (in my experience they do), then ask for an order, and also ask for your costs (i.e. the court fee, time off work, travel to court, prep of papers etc.), the judge has got to allow you the court fee at least - others are discretionary.

                              The great thing about PCOL in my opinion is you are given the court date immediately rather than having to wait for the local court to allocate a hearing which used to take longer. What is quite laborious is that you have to enter the rent payments and charges into their online form and you have to be very accurate - garbage in is garbage out!!!!!!
                              *- Pedant's note:
                              Ground 8 does not mention "arrears" in the context of a rent due monthly: just that there must be two months' rent unpaid- which means falllen due but not yet paid. There is no requirement that rent must be two full months in arrears.
                              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Members' own courtroom experiences are very useful to other members.
                                Thanks.
                                All posts in good faith, but do not rely on them

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