Tenant hoarding rubbish/junk and messing-up property

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  • jeffrey
    replied
    Originally posted by Gigabyte View Post
    As a tenant and a bit of a hoarder myself I find it a bit offensive that mathy is suggesting starting possession proceedings at this stage.

    I guess we need to know more details about the nature of this "rubbish" but I certainly dont see the justification of a LL advising a T how to live.

    I have always worked on the theory that aslong as my lifestyle does not adversely affect the fabric of my home - ie Carpets, Walls, and any furniture provided with the property then I fail to see what business the LL has poking his nose in?
    Yes, all true. L can use the three grounds mentioned in my post #3 ONLY if they apply!

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  • Gigabyte
    replied
    As a tenant and a bit of a hoarder myself I find it a bit offensive that mathy is suggesting starting possession proceedings at this stage.

    I guess we need to know more details about the nature of this "rubbish" but I certainly dont see the justification of a LL advising a T how to live.

    I have always worked on the theory that aslong as my lifestyle does not adversely affect the fabric of my home - ie Carpets, Walls, and any furniture provided with the property then I fail to see what business the LL has poking his nose in?

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by Preston View Post
    I think we all have our little foibles. My mother lives in a large house by herself. She has a very large fridge from the days when up to 7 other people lived in the house with her. The fridge is always full. Consequently, so is the bin.

    I think you asked earlier whether the "stuff etc" in this case includes organic material. The first person with this disorder I ever got to know could not throw anything away including nail clippings and orange peel. She was quite tidy in the way she stored them. She just ran out of space.

    Preston
    Pity you could not have introduced the second person you describe, to Rodent on this forum. He would have found had an economically productive use for all her clippings and orange peel, I'm sure. (If nothing else, he would've flogged it all on ebay).

    This has reminded me about a woman who lived in our street when I was growing up. She would clean her house thoroughly from top to bottom, every four hours, day and night. It took her about three hours to do it, then she'd rest/eat/shower...but within an hour she would be convinced the dirt was building up again, and start all over. Clearly, with hindsight, I'd say she needed help - but at the time, most of the other residents of the street just thought she was more than averagely houseproud, and voiced the opinion that she would be better employed coming round and cleaning other people's houses, if she liked cleaning that much.

    'A Cream Cracker Under the Settee' and 'The Outside Dog' stuff!

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  • Preston
    replied
    I think we all have our little foibles. My mother lives in a large house by herself. She has a very large fridge from the days when up to 7 other people lived in the house with her. The fridge is always full. Consequently, so is the bin.

    I think you asked earlier whether the "stuff etc" in this case includes organic material. The first person with this disorder I ever got to know could not throw anything away including nail clippings and orange peel. She was quite tidy in the way she stored them. She just ran out of space.

    Preston

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by Preston View Post
    Actually, I have a 17 year old and a 12 year old. I think I have more success dealing with assured shorthold obsessive compulsives.
    What a brilliant phrase. But at least tenants are only shorthold compulsive-obsessives. I have worked with long-hold (?) ones and they can be a worry, I agree.

    It's really hard to identify the point at which a penchant for tidiness (or forward planning) tips over into obsessive cleanliness or compulsive hoarding, isn't it? That's what I was thinking of when I made the remark about 'one person's rubbish' - who decides what is normal and what isn't? For example, my mother-in-law buys a packet of tea every time she goes to the supermarket. She has done so as long as anyone can remember, many of her cupboards are full of the stuff and she freely admits she will never drink it all. But she's happy - she knows that she will never run out of tea and she sleeps well at night in that knowledge. It's clearly not 'normal' behaviour (at least, not in my view), but if she's happy, who's to say she needs help?

    I wish some of our student tenants would be a bit more compulsive or obsessive about tidying up and cleaning, but in the end I think I would have to defend anyone's right to be untidy (except in my house!)

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  • Preston
    replied
    Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
    Hi Preston,

    Having just issued a Final, Final, Last Ultimatum to my own teenager badger re the state of his sett, I laughed long and loud (not to mention a touch hysterically) at this - I take it you don't have to share your house with teenagers?

    I think 'messy beggars' is much closer to the mark!

    Even if they did need professional help, I'm not sure the LL is the person to organise it.
    Hi, I obviously tickled your sensitivity gene!

    Actually, I have a 17 year old and a 12 year old. I think I have more success dealing with assured shorthold obsessive compulsives.

    Anyway, on the subject at hand, anyone who has worked in property management as long as I have will, I think, recognise the potential senario I am alluding to. Its more common than you might think.

    Preston

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by Preston View Post
    Hi

    This could well be completely wide of the mark, but in a housing context some types of "hoarding" can be a sign of mental health issues, such as obsessive compulsive behaviour. Nothing to worry about; just something to be aware of if it continues. It may be that the individuals concerned are receiving or need some professional support.


    Preston
    Hi Preston,

    Having just issued a Final, Final, Last Ultimatum to my own teenager badger re the state of his sett, I laughed long and loud (not to mention a touch hysterically) at this - I take it you don't have to share your house with teenagers?

    I think 'messy beggars' is much closer to the mark!

    Even if they did need professional help, I'm not sure the LL is the person to organise it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Preston
    replied
    Hi

    This could well be completely wide of the mark, but in a housing context some types of "hoarding" can be a sign of mental health issues, such as obsessive compulsive behaviour. Nothing to worry about; just something to be aware of if it continues. It may be that the individuals concerned are receiving or need some professional support.

    On the other hand, they might just be messy beggars!

    Preston

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  • Paul Gibbs
    replied
    sorry my fault - I meant that the tenant would attend rather than be forced to

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  • jeffrey
    replied
    Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
    Apologies - I interpreted your posts 6 and 8 as endorsing the idea of LL attempting to gain a possession order.

    Sorry if I was barking up the wrong tree. (Or perhaps just barking).
    I merely suggested service of a s.8 Notice.

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
    Did I? When?
    Apologies - I interpreted your posts 6 and 8 as endorsing the idea of LL attempting to gain a possession order.

    Sorry if I was barking up the wrong tree. (Or perhaps just barking).

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  • jeffrey
    replied
    Originally posted by mind the gap View Post
    You will know better than I whether a judge would be likely to grant a possession order in these circumstances, but until we know the answers to the questions I posed in #2 (specific nature of rubbish and whether it is causing property to deteriorate and how), is it not premature to advise OP to go to court over it?
    Did I? When?

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
    OK. But at least either:

    a. T will attend, be made to account for the mess, and the Court will:
    i. award L a Possession Order (perhaps suspended); or
    ii. not award possession at this stage but make it easier for L to assert- next time that L brings T before Court- that possession ought then to be ordered; or

    b. T will not attend and the Court will be at least sniffy about his absence (plus more likely to award possession, if L's evidence suffices).
    You will know better than I whether a judge would be likely to grant a possession order in these circumstances, but until we know the answers to the questions I posed in #2 (specific nature of rubbish and whether it is causing property to deteriorate and how), is it not premature to advise OP to go to court over it?

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  • jeffrey
    replied
    OK. But at least either:

    a. T will attend, be made to account for the mess, and the Court will:
    i. award L a Possession Order (perhaps suspended); or
    ii. not award possession at this stage but make it easier for L to assert- next time that L brings T before Court- that possession ought then to be ordered; or

    b. T will not attend and the Court will be at least sniffy about his absence (plus more likely to award possession, if L's evidence suffices).

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  • mind the gap
    replied
    Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
    Well, that's a start isn't it? Anyway, T is not 'bound' to attend court at all; perhaps he won't.
    Perhaps 'bound to' was being used here in its non-legal sense of 'very likely to' (as in : It's Monday, so we're bound to be having liver and onions).

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