s21/ notices to quit!

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    s21/ notices to quit!

    Please help!

    My landlord has just served a s21 notice and I want to find out a bit about validity. It gives 2 months notice and expires 31 July 2008.

    We have a 12 month lease, due to expire 12th Sept. It contains break clause provisions, with a 2 month notice period required.

    My first question is- can you use a s21 notice to excercise a break clause? I was under the impression that s21 could only be used to regain possession at the END of the tenancy- ie 12th sept.

    Secondly, does a s21 notice also count as a notice to quit? As such, what does a valid notice under the contract require to be valid? Are there any provisions that must be included in order for it to be valid? For instance, do notices under leases need to state that the tenant is entitled to legal advice etc to be valid? We want the notice to be re-served giving us the extra time on our lease..

    We are simply trying to stay till the end of the lease, a matter of 6 weeks, so any advice to avoid being kicked out early would be much appreciated!
    Thanks!

    #2
    Originally posted by nfs View Post
    Please help!

    My landlord has just served a s21 notice and I want to find out a bit about validity. It gives 2 months notice and expires 31 July 2008. If it wasn't served before 31 May then it won't be valid

    We have a 12 month lease, due to expire 12th Sept. It contains break clause provisions, with a 2 month notice period required. Is the break clause bi-lateral and were you made aware of it when you signed the tenancy agreement?

    My first question is- can you use a s21 notice to excercise a break clause? I was under the impression that s21 could only be used to regain possession at the END of the tenancy- ie 12th sept. It can be used

    Secondly, does a s21 notice also count as a notice to quit? As such, what does a valid notice under the contract require to be valid? Are there any provisions that must be included in order for it to be valid? For instance, do notices under leases need to state that the tenant is entitled to legal advice etc to be valid? We want the notice to be re-served giving us the extra time on our lease.. It's a Notice Seeking Possesison - the landlord must obtain a court order if necessary

    We are simply trying to stay till the end of the lease, a matter of 6 weeks, so any advice to avoid being kicked out early would be much appreciated!
    Thanks!
    Read your tenancy agreement first; I might not be able to give you a further reply as I'm going to be away from my computer for a few days.
    The advice I give should not be construed as a definitive answer, and is without prejudice or liability. You are advised to consult a specialist solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

    Comment


      #3
      the notice was correctly served before 31st May.

      The break clause is a 2-way notice clause, allowing either party to terminate on 2 months written notice. i think it is a valid clause.

      can someone clarify, where in the legislation does it say s21 can be used to exercise a break clause? the legislation only refers to it being used to regain posession at the end of the term. i was hoping they would have to send written notice, saying that they are excercising notice under clause x of the tenancy agreement?

      Also, as a s21 or a notice seeking possession, is it invalid if it does not contain a paragrpah stating that if the tenant is not aware of their legal rights, they can seek legal advice/CAB advice?

      thanks for any help!

      Comment


        #4
        The notice needs to be served in a prescribed format, if not served properly then would not be valid.

        Comment


          #5
          A S21 is the only way a landlord can give notice even when exercising a break clause.

          A S21 doesn't have to state that you may need to seek legal advice. It won't be invalid if it doesn't contain that.

          If you only need to stay another 6 weeks, why not negotiate with the landlord? Do you know why the landlord needs the property back

          Comment


            #6
            If a landlord serves a notice exercising a break clause it brings the fixed term tenancy to an end on the date specified. However, once the fixed term expires a statutory periodic tenancy arises under S 5(2) of the Housing Act 1988. So, once a landlord has served the break notice he needs to serve a S 21 notice.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Lawcruncher View Post
              If a landlord serves a notice exercising a break clause it brings the fixed term tenancy to an end on the date specified. However, once the fixed term expires a statutory periodic tenancy arises under S 5(2) of the Housing Act 1988. So, once a landlord has served the break notice he needs to serve a S 21 notice.
              Yes, that's true, but a prior thread points out that a s.21 Notice has been judicially held sufficient to exercise break clause rights too.
              JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
              1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
              2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
              3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
              4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jeffrey View Post
                Yes, that's true, but a prior thread points out that a s.21 Notice has been judicially held sufficient to exercise break clause rights too.
                Here's the link to the post that deals with that issue:

                http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums...6&postcount=24
                Health Warning


                I try my best to be accurate, but please bear in mind that some posts are written in a matter of seconds and often cannot be edited later on.

                All information contained in my posts is given without any assumption of responsibility on my part. This means that if you rely on my advice but it turns out to be wrong and you suffer losses (of any kind) as a result, then you cannot sue me.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by agent46 View Post
                  Here's the link to the post that deals with that issue:

                  http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums...6&postcount=24
                  Thanks for that. I could not recall where I'd seen it nor who'd posted it.
                  JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                  1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                  2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                  3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                  4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Thank you all for your help.

                    We have tried to negotiate with the landlord but he has refused our request. I think this is because he has realised rental values in the area have risen sharply and he can chagre 150 quid more per week with new tenants, therefore even 6 weeks of this is relevant to him.

                    It also seems that you can use s21 to excercise a break clause.

                    My only last question - what does s21 notice need to contain? does it need to comply with the Notice to Quit Regulations (putting in right to get legal help etc). I see one poster says no- i would appreciate some advice on this point. It has been served correctly, and does give 2 months notice. I know from reading other posts it must be in a prescribed form but am hoping to find something which invalidates the notice, and gives us the final 6 weeks of our tenancy.

                    Also does the notice need to have any bearing on when rent is paid/ when the tenancy date is? ie our tenancy is from 13th (rent paid 13th) but notice served on 29th requiring posession on 29th july.

                    thanks for all your help!

                    any help appreciated!!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      A s.21 Notice is NOT a Notice to Quit but, rather, a Notice of L's intention to apply for possession. The difference is important.
                      There is no prescribed (mandatory) form of s.21 Notice, but a Notice must comply with s.21(1)(b) or s.21(4)(a) as the case may be. Neither of these subsections demands any extra info re T's right to legal help etc.
                      JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
                      1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
                      2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
                      3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
                      4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

                      Comment

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