Can landlord serve annual s.21 Notices routinely?

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    Can landlord serve annual s.21 Notices routinely?

    Hypothetically
    If I issued ( presuming all the dates etc were overlapped to be correct and enforceable) a S21 to all of my tenants on an annual basis would that mean that I could ( presuming all dates were correct) head off down the accelerated possession route asap?????
    I hope you get what Im trying inarticulately to say.

    #2
    Originally posted by TheFoxTrust View Post
    Hypothetically
    If I issued ( presuming all the dates etc were overlapped to be correct and enforceable) a S21 to all of my tenants on an annual basis would that mean that I could ( presuming all dates were correct) head off down the accelerated possession route asap?????
    I hope you get what Im trying inarticulately to say.
    Please explain more simply. Secion 21 Notices can never lead to immediately-enforceable Possession Order during a fixed-term anyway.
    JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
    1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
    2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
    3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
    4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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      #3
      I'm sorry its ever so clear in my little lady brain, I'll try and explain.

      I mean is there a way you could issue an S21 to cover you? insurance if you like , and just have it ticking away in the background, so that if the T turns out to be Mary Poppins "great" but a lil ole nasty in there could get moved along a lot quicker, if it cant be acted on before the end of the term serve as soon as it can be acted upon (hence dates being correct etc). Am I still not making sense??, Is it a stupid idea?? , I can take it ......................really hate being done over , really want to find a loophole.

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        #4
        It's called the Sword of Damocles. Try searching the forums for it. Any "Mary Poppins" type tenant will probably leave, and the nasty ones will probably stay, leaving you with houses full of nasty tenants.

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          #5
          Thank you,
          It's official then , my last original thought has just died of loneliness.

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            #6
            Hi TheFoxTrust,

            I can see what you are saying. The answer is you can serve section 21 notice 2 seconds after signing tenancy (make sure that they are both dated and have the time they were signed to prove notice wa sgiven after the tennnacy was signed though. That is a good thing to do if you and T are signing togtehr in front of ecah other as you can get T at same time to sign and return a copy of teh notice instantly to say they have it. This removes questions of proving they receive notice later on. Hovever that only terminates the tenancy at the end of its term and can't be used to trigger anything during term.

            What you want, and can use, is section 8 notice that has multiple grounds that can be used, some mandatory (as long as Court is persuaded what you say is the case) some discretionary i.e Court may say they will give T another chance even though the court accepts what you say is the case.
            Mark Hessel

            Any comments I post are just that, comments. Every situation is unique and so you should not apply any comments I make to your situation, no matter how close they may appear to match your circumstances.

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              #7
              Originally posted by Imp View Post
              It's called the Sword of Damocles. Try searching the forums for it. Any "Mary Poppins" type tenant will probably leave, and the nasty ones will probably stay, leaving you with houses full of nasty tenants.
              I have to disagree Imp. We serve all our tenants with a S21 on key issue and have plenty of Mary Poppins tenants. In fact I have never yet had a tenant tell me they are leaving after the initial six months because we have offended them by serving them with notice when they moved in, and that's out of over a 1000 tenants!

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                #8
                what I'm getting at is the QUICKEST eviction route for someone playing silly b""""""".
                S8 can not ( I'm led to believe) be used in conjunction with an accelerated possession, whereas an S21 can, therefore speeding up the process, which is all I'm interested in, if T is being so reprehensible as to withhold rent due to me then I can find it in my stony heart to evict asap.
                I run a business, I don't think T would go to work for 3 months for their employer for free " out of the goodness of their hearts" so why should they expect a service to be provided by me for free?
                Obviously the Mary Poppins are the ones we all want and if they are reasonable then they wont mind us producing the S21 at start, if they are the spawn of Satan it may well get their heckles up if only because they cant play the system to their advantage.

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                  #9
                  And
                  Who keeps changing my post titles???
                  I dont mind , it just keeps amusing me.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    This thread may be relevant;

                    http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums...ad.php?t=11853

                    The last paragraph of the second post in the thread (Mr Lobster) seems like a sensible approach to me.
                    I also post as Moderator2 when moderating

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Thank you for the link but thats not a problem,
                      If my T do just leave, I will be the first to know. I live next door to them all so I know their commings and goings, If a car is missing for a few days and no-one else has seen them then I'll peek thorough the letterbox, Then take it from there, I dont mind if they do skip off its a lot less complicated, I just re-let asap.
                      Providing they have obviously left.

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                        #12
                        One landlord I have rented through issued a precautionary S21. I left. I would think of myself as a "Mary Poppins" based on the fact I have, without fail, paid rent and have always received my deposit back in full. I also rarely contact landlords, prefering to sort problems out myself.

                        So when the landlord sends me a legal looking document saying they require possession after a certain date, I do as asked and give them possession. If I was into playing silly buggers, then I could just ignore the S21, but I don't.

                        Remember, the laws are there to protect both landlord and tenant. They don't suit either side perfectly. You trying to circumvent the law and get early eviction without the correct due process is no different to the tenant refusing to pay you for three months. You are trying to be as bad as they are - working the system to your own unethical advantage. As such, as an honest tenant, if you tried this on with me, I would leave as soon as I was able to. Hence you have lost a good tenant and will eventually be left with the dross.

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                          #13
                          As a once professional tenant, both tenant and landlord at the same time while working abroad, I needed a 1 year+ rental. If I had been presented with what looks like a strong prospect of having to move after 6 months then I would look elsewhere. So I would say such actions could dissuade a number of good prospective tenants for no practical reason. But as a business decision and working practice I assume only TheFoxTrust is in a position to decide if any benefits of the S21 outweigh possible losses.
                          I also post as Moderator2 when moderating

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I don't mind losing T that are offended by the issuing of an immediate S21 I would explain to them why it was there and let them know there rights as well as mine, I usually work on a wait list for our homes so filling them isn't a problem its getting this one guy out that is, once they meet us and the other 9 T they can get an instant and very good understanding of the fair way we deal with them and we are treated fairly by them in return , its the rouge tenants that we all seem to get lumbered with from time to time that I'm trying to protect myself from, I'm sure as you're aware that there is a bit of a pinch on at the moment, and I consider a non paying T very much an inconvenience, anyone who believes this is an acceptable way to behave or feels the T is being mistreated by my big mean eviction is more than welcome to pay me hes 3 months arrears, I'm not looking for a moral stance I'm looking for a legal one and as such when and if I find I'm breaking no laws I will implement such, " its not personal its business", as for leaving me with the dross , they are my neighbours and my 2 small children's neighbors, they are vetted as potential neighbours not just a meal ticket. 9 out of 10 (literally are fantastic) but do I really need the hassle of one causing me such a loss, If I'm not legally overstepping any marks in issuing 21 at the beginning of tennancy I will risk offending and forgoing the thin skinned system players in favour of more like the 9 that I have at the moment.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              What is the advantage of serving the S21 notice at the start of the tenancy, why not just serve it after a few months if that is what you want to do.

                              Whilst you not mind losing a few tenants, it will reduce the amount of referencing that you need to carry out, and increase your chance of keeping good tenants.

                              I'm not sure that anyone was suggesting that you are purchasing a meal ticket, but no, there is no legal reason why you cannot serve a S21 notice at the start of your tenancy, and many people do just this.

                              Kind regards,

                              John

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