Issuing a Section 8 and Section 21 notice

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    Issuing a Section 8 and Section 21 notice

    We have a property where the tenant has been building up arrears of rent for the past year and is now three months in arrears. It is a periodic assured shorthold tenancy. She has caused all sorts of problems, denying access to the property for inspection, making false complaints and various veiled threats of actions from the authorities.

    I have read all the information on here and so I believe the procedure is to give notice under Section 8 and Section 21 at the same time.

    For the Section 8, the grounds that would seemingly apply are:


    Ground 8: The tenant is in rental arrears. (2 weeks notice.):

    She is more than two months in arrears with rent.


    Ground 1: The Landlord requires possession as he used to occupy the property as his main home or he now wishes to occupy the property as his main home. (2 months notice.):

    It is our only primary residence and we have the intention to return.


    Ground 13: Due to the tenant’s conduct, the property has deteriorated. :


    She immediately decorated throughout the property (it was newly decorated when she moved in) without seeking consent.


    Some questions:


    Do I just cite Ground 8 (bearing in mind that she might clear some arrears to make it less than two months- highly unlikely)?


    Is it worth adding the other two now or can I or should I add them later on with court proceedings?


    For the Section 21 notice, we have given her the EPC, Gas safety certificate and How to Rent guide as outlined in the flowchart.


    I am not sure which would be the best method given possible timescales.


    All input welcome. Thanks.













    #2
    Cite Grounds 8, 10 & 11, as the notice period is shorter only 2 weeks, if you add grounds 1, then you need to give 2 months notice, in which case your better off going for a S21 as will get possession of the property, the S8 is not mandatory and depends on the judge at the time.

    I would recommend S21 serve today as long as your paperwork is in order. Remember to keep sending the T on a periodic basis a statement showing the arrears.

    Comment


      #3
      I too would recommend you issue a S21 as long as you've fulfilled all the criteria. The benefit of this over a S8 is that it isn't defendable in court, except if your paperwork isn't compliant. If that is compliant, it's a very effective mechanism of getting problem tenants out, whatever spurious grounds (egs disrepair, mould, landlord harassment over rent etc) they can come up with to avoid eviction.

      If you're not experienced in evictions, I would also suggest getting a specialist eviction company to issue the S21 for you. If you want to do that, do it right from the start, as otherwise they may insist on re-serving the S21 themselves to ensure it's in order. No point doing the job twice.

      Timescales will be lengthy whatever method you choose - we're talking over 6 months. But, if done right, the S21 should do the business.

      Comment


        #4
        Thanks. The legal advice line solicitor lady (this comes with the landlord insurance) suggested issuing both Section 8 and Section 21 as the first step and then take it from there which I think I will do.

        For the Section 8, in addition to grounds 8, 10 and 11 for non payment of rent should I also cite ground 13 (damage to property which is also two weeks notice I believe) as she has decorated inside without permission? Also the garden is in a terrible state with broken furniture dumped mattresses etc.

        Thanks again.

        Comment


          #5
          You'll appreciate that you could have served a valid s8g10 at least 11 months ago... Why didn't you please?
          I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by theartfullodger View Post
            You'll appreciate that you could have served a valid s8g10 at least 11 months ago... Why didn't you please?
            I didn't know about the suggestion of issuing a section 8 notice to demonstrate you are serious about challenging rent arrears.

            My rental partner basically tolerated the tenant's nonsense and didn't want to evict her (sympathy play I guess).

            Comment


              #7
              Explain "intentionally homeless" verbally to tenants
              I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

              Comment


                #8
                I'm always concerned with issuing a notice that you don't intend to go all the way with.
                It only works once and can let the tenant understand that you're all talk.
                When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                Comment


                  #9
                  Thanks. An update:

                  We have given the Section 8 and Section 21 notices, the two weeks notice has elapsed and she hasn't got in touch. She has also stopped paying rent entirely (she is 3 1/2 months in arrears.)

                  A couple more questions:

                  Would it be sensible to send her an email saying your notice period has elapsed, please get in touch to arrange a date for the handover of keys and completing an inventory? How do you actually determine whether a tenant is still there?- there seem to be less windows open at the property- you can't turn up and access the property to find out.

                  Secondly, we have landlord legal insurance and have been asked to submit a claim by them who will appoint a solicitor if successful and take it from there (they have said to do nothing at this point.) I am just wondering though, having had alot of experience with inefficient solicitors before who mess things up or leave cases in intrays for weeks would it be better to do the possession proceedings ourselves?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Folio1 View Post
                    Would it be sensible to send her an email saying your notice period has elapsed, please get in touch to arrange a date for the handover of keys and completing an inventory? How do you actually determine whether a tenant is still there?- there seem to be less windows open at the property- you can't turn up and access the property to find out.
                    You send the tenant written notice of an inspection at a convenient time, giving at least 24 hours notice and that if they're not there, you can let yourself in.
                    Then turn up at the time notified to do exactly that.

                    If you can, post the notice through the door, in case the tenant has moved and is redirecting their mail.
                    When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                    Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                    Comment


                      #11
                      So this is nice- the claim for legal help with the eviction with the landlord insurance through ARAG has been rejected because the tenant was £200 in arrears at the time the policy was taken out over a year ago. So basically I have been paying for something that could never have been used. What a joke. Free money for the insurance company.

                      So on to the issue of what possession proceedings to use. I thought to use section 8- the tenant is 4 1/2 months in arrears and has stopped paying rent, has said "see you in court" and is ignoring my request for access. Otherwise with Section 21 I would need to wait another 7 weeks.

                      I thought also of doing a MCOL for the £4000 of rent arrears. It might make her realise she can't just live in another persons home rent free.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Folio1 View Post
                        So this is nice- the claim for legal help with the eviction with the landlord insurance through ARAG has been rejected because the tenant was £200 in arrears at the time the policy was taken out over a year ago. So basically I have been paying for something that could never have been used. What a joke. Free money for the insurance company.

                        ...............
                        Ask Insurer, calm and polite, how (and exactly where documented..) you should have known that restriction.

                        Do let us know the response, please.
                        I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

                        Comment


                          #13
                          This is the small print they are quoting:

                          Although there is cover provided under your policy for repossession and the recovery of rent arrears, I must bring your attention to the following policy conditions which are applicable to the whole policy;

                          What is not covered

                          d) Any claim arising from or relating to;

                          ii. any actual or alleged act, omission or dispute occurring prior to, or existing at the start of cover under this section which you knew or ought reasonably to have known could give rise to a claim under this section

                          iii. any disagreement with your tenant during the first 90 days of the first period of insurance where the tenancy agreement started before the start of your cover (unless you had similar cover in force to this cover immediately before the start date of this cover)

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Folio1 View Post
                            I thought also of doing a MCOL for the £4000 of rent arrears. It might make her realise she can't just live in another persons home rent free
                            Don't do both at the same time - you'll be chasing the same debt in two different processes and you don't want the possibility of any confusion.

                            When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                            Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                            Comment

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