Viewings at end of tenancy and during S21 notice period

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    #16
    "If the tenant doesn't move out, and the tenancy agreement provides for the tenancy to continue in that circumstance, the tenancy continues."

    Jpkeates how/why would it do this! ?

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      #17
      Originally posted by FOXGLOVE View Post

      How so it's in the agreement? And what applies during the S21 notice because effectively the tenancy has ended on 1 August and he is on the S21 notice which I believe when issued was a 6 month notice


      Even if it’s in your agreement, given 2 months, it wouldn’t be worth the effort or cost in going to court to force through viewings in that limited time. Tenants could come up with a host of reasons too anyway specially right now with COVID 19 albeit possibly lying about being ill or simply not wanting people walking through their property touching things potentially. They may not actually care about COVID 19 but use it as an excuse.

      have a read

      https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/ab...nts-stay-safe/

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        #18
        Originally posted by FOXGLOVE View Post

        Was told to do so as I mentioned to the agent I might want to sell, didn't ask why now worrying why?
        Have you told the tenant you want to sell? Maybe they would buy it.

        In an earlier post you mentioned possibly re-letting it. It seems odd to give notice to the current tenant without a clear plan, unless the tenant has done something wrong.

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          #19
          Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
          a viewing with the tenant's stuff in situ is never a good idea - I don't ever do it.
          I thought you used a full management letting agent for everything?

          About a third of my tenants keep their homes like showhomes and enthusiastically recommend me as a landlord. Of those I get pretty much one in/one out.

          I'd say 98% of my tenants overall would allow viewings if I wanted them to (I always ask).
          -It's what any decent, reasonable person would do.

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            #20
            I do use an agent for full management.
            They/we don't do viewings with tenants in place.

            They do sessions with lots of people all at once and only when the tenant has moved out and we've checked the place doesn't need work.
            To be honest that hasn't happened since Covid though.

            I'm not saying anyone else is wrong, though, just sharing my own experience.
            There are lots of different ways to do this job!
            When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
            Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

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              #21
              Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
              I'm not saying anyone else is wrong,
              It sounded very much like it;

              Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
              a viewing with the tenant's stuff in situ is never a good idea
              Sorry to be picky but this has been the type of stuff housing charities and activist lawyers have made 'campaigns' about.
              And we end up with another useless piece of legislation making a 28 day gap between tenancies mandatory.

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                #22
                Originally posted by boletus View Post
                It sounded very much like it;
                I do have a habit of expressing my views quite forcefully.
                They're opinions, but I don't always say so explicitly - perhaps it's an issue with posting regularly.

                Sorry to be picky but this has been the type of stuff housing charities and activist lawyers have made 'campaigns' about.
                And we end up with another useless piece of legislation making a 28 day gap between tenancies mandatory.
                And conversely, no need to apologise, being picky is an excellent habit and I am usually happy to be disagreed with.
                Particularly by people who know what they're talking about who happen to have a different view on something.
                When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

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                  #23
                  "within the last 2 months of tenancy to permit LL or authorized person by LL to enter view the property with prospective tenants or purchasers, giving reasonable notice."

                  There are two aspects to that.

                  The first is whether the tenant can refuse access. The practical answer is that he he can. The legal answer is that, so long as the landlord is being reasonable, he cannot without being in breach of the agreement. See further the first two posts in this thread: https://forums.landlordzone.co.uk/fo...ion-or-viewing.

                  The second is how to interpret the clause. If the tenancy is fixed term then while the fixed term is current the "last 2 months of tenancy" is the last two months of the fixed term. However, if the tenant stays on after the fixed term expires, an entirely new periodic tenancy begins. When the last two months of that tenancy are will not be known unless and until the tenant serves a notice to quit.

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                    #24
                    Lawcruncher,

                    Thank you once the tenancy has expired if the notice period ends up being 4 months in respect of served S21 notice then would it be the last 2 months of the S21 notice?

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                      #25
                      Originally posted by FOXGLOVE View Post

                      Thank you once the tenancy has expired if the notice period ends up being 4 months in respect of served S21 notice then would it be the last 2 months of the S21 notice?
                      A section 21 doesn't end a tenancy. So issuing a section 21 doesn't tell you when the last 2 months of the tenancy are.

                      You're best to talk to your tenant and hope they are willing to be cooperative. You could offer an incentive.

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                        #26
                        Until tenancy ends by tenant serving NTQ then leaving or, as is his absolute legal right (Thatcher 1988 Housing Act) to stay until court order, expiry of order, bailiffs/hceo then you don't know when tenancy ends so don't know even when last 2 months start(!).

                        Might I 'umbly suggest a little basic training might perhaps pay dividends? If I might not suggest, so be it. (Or have you done training please?)
                        I am legally unqualified: If you need to rely on advice check it with a suitable authority - eg a solicitor specialising in landlord/tenant law...

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                          #27
                          theartfullodger,

                          Humbly accepted.. 😁

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by boletus View Post

                            About a third of my tenants keep their homes like showhomes and enthusiastically recommend me as a landlord. Of those I get pretty much one in/one out.

                            I'd say 98% of my tenants overall would allow viewings if I wanted them to (I always ask).
                            -It's what any decent, reasonable person would do.
                            This. It makes such a difference. I'm currently letting two identical flats, one above the other. Their notices expire a day apart. Same asking price. I've even used the same photos for the ads (they really are identical). One pair would like to leave early if I can get tenants in so I focused on letting their place first. There is nothing wrong with it at all but they have not made it at all homely -bikes and metal pc desks in the living room. Grey linen. No pictures on the walls. I've done twenty viewings and it won't budge. The one upstairs from it is colourful and homely. The tenants are always super smiley and have mostly been cooking something nice when I've done viewings. It went the same week I started showing it.

                            The only time I have ever had trouble being allowed access for viewings was one tenant during covid. And he was very awkward rather than unwilling.

                            Only rarely have I not bothered showing whilst the tenant was in situ - if I plan to redecorate or they are particularly messy and untidy.

                            My experience is mostly letting to young degree educated professionals. 9/10 people are really reasonable and the contract rarely gets referred to.
                            Assume I know nothing.

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