Notice to Quit validity in Joint tenancy which is rolling now.

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    #61
    Quick update , I checked my notice Track and Trace on Royal Mail and it is delivered this morning 09:59AM. Hope I beat the dead line of 13th.
    Now all I need to wait and see what Estate agent says for email notice.

    Comment


      #62
      I have another question on the same topic. After reading through various forums and online , I found there are 2 opinions which are contradictory.
      1st one says if one tenant leaves the contract with proper notice and landlord can chase only remaining tenants for the rent after notice period
      second says even valid notice, technically contract not ended and Landlord still chase the tenant who left the property.

      Which option is right one?

      Comment


        #63
        Neither is correct.

        If the tenant's notice is valid, when it expires, the tenancy has ended and all of the occupants have to leave the property or the one's that wish to remain have to reach a new agreement with the landlord.
        There are no special rules about the new agreement, which is entirely optional for the landlord and new tenants, as it would be a completely new and separate tenancy.

        If the landlord believes that the remaining group of people can't afford the rent, or wishes to increase the rent to a level that's not affordable by the remaining group, a new agreement may not be possible.

        If the people who haven't served notice pay the landlord rent, a new tenancy is almost certainly created by that action.

        The tenant who has left is not part of this new arrangement and isn't liable for more rent going forward.

        Rent owed under the current tenancy remains the responsibility of all of the current tenants, and that doesn't change when the tenancy ends, the debt remains with the same group of people.
        When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
        Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

        Comment


          #64
          It has occurred to me that one thing that the agent may not have considered is that your divorce made the property into an HMO, because you are now two households with more than three people in occupation.
          Most private residences don't meet the requirements for an HMO (because the fire regulations are more strict) and it's possible that your local authority might require the landlord has a licence to operate such a property (not all do for four people).

          The agent should probably be quite keen to get you out, because the remaining occupants are all one family and the property will no longer be an HMO.
          When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
          Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

          Comment


            #65
            Thank you very much. Just understood what is HMO and it might be possibility. While looking forr flat on right move, i have seen ad ifor 1 bed room house share by same estate agent. If that is any indication, he might have HMO license. Correct me if i am wrong.
            But saying in email all signatures neefed for my previous noice shows his lack of knowledge. It can be intrepreted as misguiding and forcing tenant to stay as he has given wrong information. Also i belueve estate agent should approach other tenants or vice versa if one tenant terminates the contract. As his premise is wrong that one tenant can't give notice and all signatures needed causing issues. Actually i am counting on that if it goes to that court level.

            Few days ago i opened ask a lawyer account for another issur, but i raised same issue. I was advised notice is valid like we all agree, but said if remaining tenants stay and don't pay, estate agent can drag me in to arrears case.

            When i cited shelter website after properly served notice, there is no liabilities for tenant who left. He said don't believe all you read online and he insist he is right.

            There is no written agreement between tenants how rent should be paid. But i paid every month through standing order(44) and do i have any chance to win if i go to small claims courts against x-in-laws.

            Comment


              #66
              Once again, thanks JPkeates. I believe S13 notice in March (which I slept on it) and my x-wife talked to Citizens Advice Bureau about rent increase. She mentioned estate agent has no right to increase the rent , She mentioned she will sue him as she knows he is operating without some kind of Licenses and Council/Citzen advise bureu told her that point.

              It seems she is talking about the same HMO license which you mentioned. But It is very good point. Do you think I should ask him about his HMO license status as we are more than 3 tenants and different house hold and need HMO license. or wait as my x-wife knows but she is waiting for estate agent move?
              .

              Comment


                #67
                Originally posted by Anilkumar View Post
                Few days ago i opened ask a lawyer account for another issur, but i raised same issue. I was advised notice is valid like we all agree, but said if remaining tenants stay and don't pay, estate agent can drag me in to arrears case.

                When i cited shelter website after properly served notice, there is no liabilities for tenant who left. He said don't believe all you read online and he insist he is right.
                He can definitely drag you into a claim for arrears that arise before the tenancy ends.
                You are in some degree liable for that debt, and can't avoid it simply be ending the tenancy and moving on.

                The agent can try and drag you into a claim for future arrears, but could only do so if they can persuade a judge that you continued to be a tenant - which might need to be done in court, so you could definitely be dragged into the case, I just don't think you'd be liable.

                And always take the advice of a professional over someone on a forum!
                When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                Comment


                  #68
                  Originally posted by Anilkumar View Post
                  After reading little bit about HMO , I believe estate agent has HMO license. But understood HMO property has different set of rules and regulations. Seems it needs communal area and regular maintenance of that area.
                  HMO regulations don't require a communal area, in a lot of cases they have communal areas because a lot of HMOs rent space by the bedroom with access to a shared kitchen and bathroom.
                  Your property can still be an HMO rented as one shared complete property.

                  It doesn't matter if the agent has an HMO licence or not, it matters if they have one for the property you are living in (if it needs one, lots of 4 occupant HMOs don't).
                  But the rules for an HMO that doesn't need a licence at all aren't that different to one that does.
                  For example, there has to be some kind of a fire risk assessment, and that would mandate fire retardant doors and a hard wired smoke alarm system with regular maintenance.
                  Which most residential properties simply don't have.
                  When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                  Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                  Comment


                    #69
                    Thanks once again. I understand as it started as simple case of notice to quit and validity of notice and seems dragged HMO into the issue. Honestly talking to friends who is renting for years never heard about HMO. So forum gives the opportunity to get some ideas esp. For beginners like me.. It is a educatiom into rental properties and legalities. I rented from 2000 to 2007 and we paid rent on time and left property with one month notice and never had issues. So i assumed it is very easy as long as you are responsible tenant. But it is mind boggling if issues turn into different direction.

                    I will pay till rent second notice and i paid for 45 months on 30th of every month. Yes this month rent paid my X as i thought if she pays rent as it creates automatic tenancy on rest of 3 tenants and i am free to go. But it got backfired as she kept it her self.
                    I am one month due right now. I go and get a flat or shared room as i need to increase my deposit to buy house. But i will get some proof that i am not living there in the house as i don't want to give estate agent to try to argue that i am still a tenant living there. But honestly i moved my mail to my friends house 2 yrs ago and i stay there when i go to London. But thanks for all your advise. But i will talk to professional when it comes to that extents as i know it expensive as i tried in May. But i don't hesitate if situation reaches to that extent.

                    But learned a lot on this forum.

                    Comment


                      #70
                      But never mentioned, we are not 4 tenants, we have 2 children too but one turned into 19 and other 15. So i understood HMO counts children too. So we are 6 people living in there. I mean as i believe and hoping HMO situation created and that put estate agent on back foot in this battle 😁

                      Comment


                        #71
                        Good thinking. 4 tenant’s plus the 19 year old is 5 adults in two households.
                        So it needs a licence.

                        Good luck.
                        When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                        Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                        Comment


                          #72
                          Ok guys. Estate agent ignored my second notice and instead asking me to pay rent for this month. If i pay by today, they will ignore it.

                          As i mentioned earlier i paid rent to my x who decided to keep it herself. Also threatened we need to allow EPG inspection as i understood rest of tenants not openimg door when that guy turned up.

                          Unfortunately i have no money to pay unless i dip into overdraft. But when i get salary i pay as much i can ex. Last 15 days rent( notice) and 50% of this month rent. So far we have paid all the rent and arrears should be £100 as out of 44 months, x-paid only month of £900. Also i am actively looking for new place and not sure how much i need to pay as i doubt estate agent gives any referance.

                          I am lead on the contract as deposit on my name. But i am thinkimg of not responding to his email as i prefer let Estate agent take some action.
                          For my defence, i gave one notice through email ending May14th. But paid rent for May.

                          Second defence is tell him sort of HMO licence as he is in clear breach of that provision.

                          What you people suggest?

                          Comment


                            #73
                            I would pay no further rent until your notice has expired and you have moved out.
                            You will owe it, so keep it set aside.
                            If you pay rent now, there is a (small) risk that you might start a new tenancy.

                            Your notice expires soon and you need to move out before it does.
                            You don't have much time to find a new place.

                            If your notice expires and you don't move out and one of the other tenants pays any rent at all, you will arguably have a new joint tenancy and will have to start all over again.

                            Your questions are now simply repeats of earlier questions and there is no new advice to offer or information to supply.

                            It is time to stop worrying and planning and time to take some decisive action.
                            If you do not, you may as well simply be resigned to being in the same situation for the foreseeable future.

                            When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
                            Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

                            Comment


                              #74
                              Thanks. I already set up a viewing this Friday and hope it goes well as referances will be an issue. But happy to explain landlord the situation and ready to pay 6 months rent (borrowed from friends). But available only on 10th July. Meanwhile looking at Airbnb options too and happy to move there as i don't want to stick this place any more. The minute i realised my x hasn't paid rent and that is last straw. But i prefer to have some kind of solution whichever way, no issue. Yes emails for rent arrears make me into stress as i prefer easy and peaceful life.

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