Difficult Tenants Not Replying Lack of Rent and How to Evict!

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  • Jon66
    I think I am ok for the EICR currently but will endeveour (sic) to get this done going forward with any new tenancies.

    This is what I mean about your attitude.

    If you wait to get the electrical checks done you will run out of time. Can you not see that if the requirement for electrical safety cert is for this to be carried out by 1st April 2021, electricians will be exceptionally busy. Not to mention having to allow time for any remedial work.

    You will not get your tenants out by April 21 because you have to give 6m notice so get it done now.

    You will run out of time . . . 🙄

    Leave a comment:

  • SSD1000

    Thanks mate for the advice

    I did look down the assisted payment option from Housing Benefit however they will need to clear it with the tenant am I correct in this? If thats the case and the tenant disagrees with this it leaves me with an even more annoyed tenant and potentially no payment

    I am more than happy to get the repairs done - it is my asset at the end of the day -

    Regarding getting a professional mediator whom can help - do you know of any websites or individuals that could step in or of certain professions? Could I get another landlord to help to mediate?

    I will be looking to send a letter to the tenants (outlining the Gas certificate check)

    Regarding the EICR I have just looked at the Gov.uk website

    "3. Which rented properties do the Electrical Safety Regulations apply to?

    The regulations came into force on 1 June 2020, they apply to new tenancies from 1 July 2020 and existing tenancies from 1 April 2021. The relevant date for determining when the new requirements apply is the date on which the tenancy is granted. A new tenancy is one that was granted on or after 1 June 2020."

    I think I am ok for the EICR currently but will endeveour to get this done going forward with any new tenancies. I just want to be within regulations and not burn bridges. I am trying to be a good landlord and provide a service as this is what we are trying to provide at the end of the day

    Thanks for your advice again

    Leave a comment:

  • Stew
    The challenge I see is that you are worried about the legal process of getting them out when other things are out of shape with the property.

    It's no good saying "I have even said I may sell the property therefore may need to give them notice in August 2020 and they did not like it one bit - I can only afford so much from my contingency fund to keep the property running without the rental payments."

    That is not the case at all, if you sell you cannot force them to move, you will have to sell with them in situ and take a lower price due to your current situation with the tenants as that will be brought up.

    You need a third party with experience to help out as it looks like your relationship has broken down. You will probably have to pay for this but it will be money well spent I think.

    No one is bashing you, but it seems you don't have the experience to deal with this yourself, so I advise a good agent or other person that you know that can mediate for you.

    I personally think if it went to court and there were windows damaged for years the judge would not help you at all.

    Find someone who can knock on the door to explain that the gas safe check is needed to ensure the tenants safety (which is the case) and arrange it with them. If however you are at the point where they think you just want the CP12 to start an eviction you will have little luck and your best chance is to contact the council and tell them this so at least it is registered with an official body regarding the refusal to enter to perform the checks.

    Also make sure you have the EICR done shortly.

    All the best,,, no one is trying to bash you but it's obvious you are struggling, being a landlord is not easy for everything so find someone to help who can mediate without it getting heated,,, any threat made to them will just backfire on you at this time with the world as it is.....

    Try and rebuild the relationship and get some money flowing in the correct directionm,,, or apply for managed payments (that is the Housing element of UB to be paid direct to you, you can do that online)

    I have no legal training just my personal view.

    All the best

    Leave a comment:

  • SSD1000
    Jon66 - I have got a clue and taking your opinions into account. If the tenant does not give me access to the property to fit a bath panel which they have damaged themselves is not my fault.

    Furthermore, I think I am a good landlord as I am pushing ahead with the Gas and Carbon Monoxide checks, I have offered to get repair men around prior to the current lockdown.

    On New Years Day in 2018 they had a water leak from the stop cock under the sink. I was there straightaway with my plumber to get the job resolved. The plumber fixed the leak with further callout made to the water company to review the issue outside.

    If your trying to be a good landlord good on you however, we all should be a given a chance and opportunity I am sure you was wet behind the ears and didn't graduate from Landlord school within 1 week?

    You learn from mistakes and experience that cannot be bought or learned

    I have taken the points that have been given on this board

    - If I give a Section 21 it will not be accelerated thus there is the condition of not evicting a tenant during a pandemic and a notice of 6 months (as per gov.uk website) since September 2020

    - If I give a Section 21 tomorrow I have a valid Gas Certificate that was completed November 2019 and is valid until middle of November 2020

    - I do not wish to give a Section 21 as I run the risk of any monies being received from the tenants for the next 6-8 months. Those parasites are receiving Housing benefits as I have already contacted the LA about this and they have informed me of this.

    - I do not wish them to leave my house damaged and in a dire state if I give them eviction notice. Its better receiving minimal monies then nothing over a period of time do you not agree?

    When the government lift the stupid restrictions of 6 month notice then I could potentially give a notice period under Section 21.

    The only thing that bothers me is the judge raising the concern on the following:

    My copy of the tenancy agreement issued last October 2019 I have misplaced and lost unfortunately due to moving house in March 2020

    The repairs outstanding to the two windows in the property

    The garden with the weeds and the the tree even though the tenants did not want this cutting down late last year

    I have not given them letters through the post as there is no chance they would reply or bother opening them

    I have been lenient and understanding (not sure if this is a good landlord) - I have got the gutters cleared out they were not cleared since the beginning of time, the landlady previously who owned the property never bothered with the tenants, I have reduced the rent arrears they owed me through a gesture of goodwill, Paid for Paint for the property when they wanted to re-decorate, given them documentation when they needed their Housing benefit approved.

    They are not good people and I inherited them when I bought the property - to put it in context my gas engineer has been in the industry for 30 years and even he said they are not the nicest people

    The Whatsapp messages are now held as evidence in Court and they have a time and date of when they have been sent and date and time of when the recipient has read the message/s

    I came for advice and various individuals have given me some (many thanks for that) but I do not need the bashing

    All I want is my property back - I have said to the tenants I am happy to set up a payment plan or discuss options with them otherwise they will have to leave the property.

    I understand if they damage the property I can put a criminal charge against them going forward if they leave the property in a damaged state when they do leave.

    Leave a comment:

  • Jon66
    Op has been advised on here extensively but doesn't appear to be taking any of the advice on board and doesn't have a clue.

    4 months to supply and fit a bath panel is pretty poor plus the property doesn't sound in good condition.

    I despair of these type of posts. I try to be a good landlord but unprofessional landlords drag the rest of us down.

    Leave a comment:

  • Interlaken
    Something tells me you are not cut out to be a landlord. Nearly everyone of us on here has had troubles with tenants not paying rent and refusing all contact as some time or other and more so now. You need to be patient as in this pandemic there is NO help for landlords and some of us are having trouble getting tenants to pay rent. There is no quick fix. I don't think What'App is a professional way to conduct your relationship with the tenant. They may be playing the non payment game or just don't have the money.
    Take it a step at a time.
    There is a good chance that a tradesman, not yourself may gain access and get the work done.
    Inform the tenants in writing on paper delivered through the letterbox that you have arranged for a gas engineer (give name and company) to call at a set time and date. Send gas engineer along with a set of keys in case they are out. (I take it you have a set that works?) Some may consider this a bit dodgy but I would take that chance for peaceful entry to carry out the work if tenants are not in. This way you have a record that you have tried to get this work done. If you can't get the gas work done then consider contacting HSE (https://www.hse.gov.uk/) - I have used them before to negotiate entry to a property where tenant will not allow the gas safety survey to take place. If all this fails and the boiler breaks down there is your opportunity!

    Leave a comment:

  • SSD1000
    Regarding the Weed and other jobs I am happy to get them fixed The attic window I already have quotes to fit a new one and the bedroom window which is not shutting appropriately. The bathroom panel was damaged and I replaced this in August 2020 when they informed in May 2020. It was not a vital thing i.e. life could still carry on they have water and other essentials running without any issues. I want to help them and be a good LL however there needs to be a communication and understanding on both sides.

    Furthermore there was a large tree in the back garden which was going into the neighbours garden they complained to the council who contacted me last year. I notified the council that I want to get this cut down straightaway without any problem. I informed the tenants we need to get the tree cut down however they did not want me to get it cut down. I got the quotes and had workmen ready to come and treat this large old tree. Now this summer surprise surprise the tenants want me to remove the tree branches during a difficult period with Covid and getting hold of any workmen to carry out a job (Tree surgeons are difficult to get hold off during the summer periods as you will know)

    My worry is if I send an official letter they will ignore it or say I am harassing them if I outline to them that a Gas Certificate is required by Law. I would also like to mention for the millionth time the rent that is due...

    If I send a Section 21 to gain possession it will take 6 months + to evict them thanks to the governments latest 6 months notice period to evict idiots

    What worries me is if I do go down the Section 21 process - and it gets to court I do not want a judge to side with them and say such and such repairs have not been carried out - they owe rent and have not given me access lately or replied to my messages. All I would want is possession of my property and land - would you think a judge of this land would deny me this?

    I have even said I may sell the property therefore may need to give them notice in August 2020 and they did not like it one bit - I can only afford so much from my contingency fund to keep the property running without the rental payments.

    They have said they are working on reduced hours due to Covid however they are receiving benefits and just taking a free ride from my view. They can afford to pay Council Tax and Elec, Gas why not rent? They cant live rent free regardless of repairs or not. When they are not managing the cleanliness of the garden and the house they had rats and I got rid of them professionally. I had the gutters cleaned out without them even complaining and have wanted to get the repairs done. They had rabbits with hutches in the front living room and i informed them that no pets are allowed after the rabbits died. They currently have a dog in the property.

    They have the money to decorate and put new flooring down however not enough to pay rent

    If I go down a professional route I will look to get legal advice and explain the current situation. I contacted the tenants last night via WhatsApp as this is my only option to inform them that I need to get a Gas Engineer to come and review the Boiler and any other gas appliances. Still awaiting a reply from the idiot I call my tenant. He tends to grow a brain when a new legislation comes through or when he is avoiding the need to pay rent. He is reading the messages however not replying (Is his fingers becoming redundant when I ask for rent and arrangement to do the repairs?) I know a lot of LLs must be in my situation or a similar circumstance its a piss take and then us LLs get taken for idiots.

    I do not mind taking courses but I am young and learning as a I progress through the LL world. I have been reading on various legislations and trying to get help where possible.

    All I want is the tenants to either pay the due rent of arrears or leave the property without damaging it within the next month and I will forego the rent due as best possible option? What else can I suggest?

    Leave a comment:

  • Stew
    Sorry to say this but you sound in a real muddle, weeds and a window problem should have a taken a couple of weeks to resolve, it sounds like you have taken a long time to do a few small jobs, I may be misreading your comments though.

    In terms of money owned they are not that far befind yet, you need to find out why they reduced payments first, are they unhappy with your jobs? or have they lost jobs / income.

    If for instance you have streams of whatsapp messages with no reply you probably need to withdraw step back and get someone to manage this for you who has more experience in this field. Ask a third party with some experience to help liaise.

    If they refuse to let in a gas engineer you will need to report this to the council and also show evidence that you have tried to arrange. A string of whatsapp messages will not be enough in my view.

    Hope things improve.

    All the best

    Leave a comment:

  • Jon66
    For evictions I understand there are some agents specialising in this some of whom advertise here.

    Leave a comment:

  • Jon66
    Originally posted by SSD1000 View Post
    Hi Hudson

    What can I do in the meantime let the tenants pay mediocre rent or send a section 21 and wait on my hands for 6-8 months with potentially no income at all but paying from my own pocket? Even then I cannot submit a S21 unless I have a valid Gas Certificate which expires mid November 2020 as mentioned by JPKeates. Would it be wise to contact the local council authority and inform them of unpaid rent from the tenants who they are paying housing benefit too? Could they forward me rent payments or would they have to get consent from the tenants?
    Yes, sit and wait out the s21 is pretty much the option. It sounds as though you didn't go into this with your eyes wide open. For next time, it's a good idea to keep a contingency for exactly this happening. If you have only one property, at least the equivalent of one year's rent is a good idea. And absolutely essential if you have a mortgage, otherwise it impacts hugely on your lifestyle.

    There is a homelessness prevention fund held by the local authority. Is it possible to try to be helpful toward your tenants? If you go in with a much more conciliatory approach you could suggest they make an application to the local authority or to one of the charities for help with their rent. None of the charities or the LA will help unless the tenancy is sustainable. What that means is if they are unlikely to be able to meet their rent payments in the future, they are unlikely to be assisted.

    The local authority also operate the discretionary housing payments. These are available if the tenant is already receiving housing benefit. Application on a form to the LA.

    This is stuff you really need to know these days. Please don't feel I keep moaning at you, but this is a business much like any other, and you need to know the statutory framework, sources of help and assistance, and how to deal with difficult and awkward tenants.

    As the lockdown has just been announced, now is a good time to have a chat with your tenants to see if you can help them in anyway. Speak to the LA on Monday and see what they need to enable them to assist your tenants.

    If you have a look on the Mumsnet homepage, (yes really) there are some useful links to the Turn2Us charity listings. This is a good source of help to establish whether there are any charities that might help.

    Leave a comment:

  • Lots on
    Once this situation is behind you, with your next tenants I feel you should consider employing an agent for full management, at least while you get yourself educated on landlord legislation and responsibilities. I would also advise joining the NRLA , their helpline is really useful.

    Leave a comment:

  • SSD1000
    Hi Hudson

    Thanks for your update

    I will be seeking legal assistance are there any landlord based solicitors who can assist with my query?

    What can I do in the meantime let the tenants pay mediocre rent or send a section 21 and wait on my hands for 6-8 months with potentially no income at all but paying from my own pocket? Even then I cannot submit a S21 unless I have a valid Gas Certificate which expires mid November 2020 as mentioned by JPKeates. Would it be wise to contact the local council authority and inform them of unpaid rent from the tenants who they are paying housing benefit too? Could they forward me rent payments or would they have to get consent from the tenants?

    Leave a comment:

  • Hudson01
    Originally posted by SSD1000 View Post
    This government is not helping at all in this difficult period what about the landlord who's trying to help tenants and house individuals?
    The govt is not in the business of helping LL's, its there for the tenants (as we have seen over the past few years), as stated above, get professional help, you will be going round in circles with this. I can only see this getting worse for you and the arrears increasing...... stop and think about where you are going with this, you do not have the required knowledge, a forum is ok for general advice and information but in your case i would not rely upon it totally to guide your future actions.

    Leave a comment:

  • SSD1000
    Seems a nightmare!
    So if they are due £500 rent and I serve notice today they could forego paying anything until the court case for s21 (non-accelerated route) for another 6-8 months which could cost me £4000 loss of rental income!

    Plus I have to get access to get a Gas Check done by end of next month (November 2020) in order to have a valid S21 eviction as mentioned in the posts from yourselves previously

    This government is not helping at all in this difficult period what about the landlord whos trying to help tenants and house individuals?

    Leave a comment:

  • jpkeates
    Originally posted by SSD1000 View Post
    Can I serve notice for possession without my copy of the tenancy agreement?
    Yes, but you can't use the accelerated s21 route.

    If i sue them through the Small Courts what is the expected process and costs?
    Googe "money claim online" - the cost depends on the amount claimed, but likely to be between £100 and £200 (which you add to the amount claimed).

    Leave a comment:

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