Difficult situation with tenants

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  • mariner
    replied
    Stop digging an expensive hole and undertake some LL training, pref with .NLA/RLA.

    Leave a comment:


  • jpkeates
    replied
    If the rent is paid to you, it completely undermines the notion that your son is the other occupant's landlords.

    If you don't appreciate that that's a really stupid idea, this is never going to work.
    I'd take some (paid) professional advice before you do anything else.

    This is a (highly regulated) business.

    Standard landlord's insurance isn't likely to work, either.


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  • mn90312
    replied
    Thanks for the replies. I have served them the section 21 notice now and in future I will ensure the we have a lodgers agreement between my son and other occupants in the property. I have landlords insurance on the house and was wondering if removing the AST agreements would have any bearing on my insurance policy. For tax purposes, the new occupants would pay the money into my bank account; would this create more complications and unknowingly imply a tenancy? I am just trying to make sure this doesn't happen again.

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  • DPT57
    replied
    My understanding is that a tenant can be a licensee if they share the property with a member of the landlords immediate family who is not themselves a tenant. This may be what a court would decide as the occupation status is meant to reflect the facts rather than the paperwork, but as I indicated earlier, the fact that they were given an AST could be interpreted as an intention to grant more security, which the landlord is perhaps now estopped from overturning.

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  • mn90312
    replied
    Hi thanks for the advice - the AST reads as below

    Dwelling

    Contents: The fixtures and fittings at the Property together with any other items as agreed between Landlord and Tenant

    Term: 6 months with a 3 month break clause.

    Commencing on: 18 November 2019

    Rent: £758.33 per calendar month including all bills

    Payment: in advance by equal monthly payments on the 18th of each month.

    Deposit: £758.33

    The deposit will be protected by The Deposit Protection Service (The DPS)

    - My son found these tenants online and did advertise himself as a live in landlord, although I dont know if there is any loophole out of an AST and to evict on the grounds of being lodgers.

    Thanks

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  • jpkeates
    replied
    Originally posted by hamilton View Post
    I'm quite aware of this! However OP makes clear that they are both the owner and the landlord. The two cousins are tenants with room-only ASTs, which non-resident OP has signed as the landlord.
    My point was that the agent's advice was wrong.
    It was quite possible for the son to be the other 2 occupant's landlord.

    So the agent's poor advice has contributed to the mess.

    My point was that the agent didn't know what they were talking about, not you.

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  • hamilton
    replied
    Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
    It isn't necessary to be the owner of the property to be the landlord.
    I'm quite aware of this! However OP makes clear that they are both the owner and the landlord. The two cousins are tenants with room-only ASTs, which non-resident OP has signed as the landlord.

    Is there potentially any wiggle room as to the legal status of the son? Presumably he didn't also sign a room-only AST with his mother. But he can't be said to be one-half of the landlord - or can he?

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  • jpkeates
    replied
    Originally posted by mn90312 View Post
    It is described as "Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement - For the letting of a room in a shared house or flat"
    How is the property described, it doesn't really matter what the agreement says it is.
    Originally posted by hamilton View Post
    I don't see how the agent has been poor, it sounds like they have just informed you of the law.
    Except that isn't the law.
    It isn't necessary to be the owner of the property to be the landlord.



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  • mariner
    replied
    Did you protect their Deposits?

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  • hamilton
    replied
    I don't see how the agent has been poor, it sounds like they have just informed you of the law.

    Next time, listen to your son! It would indeed have been far better if they were his lodgers. Then they would have known that he was the boss of the house.

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  • mn90312
    replied
    It is described as "Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement - For the letting of a room in a shared house or flat". The agent has been very poor and advised that as the owner of the property I am the landlord and as I am not living there I cannot have a lodgers agreement.

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  • jpkeates
    replied
    Could you explain exactly what the AST says that the tenant is renting - how is the property described?

    What reason did the agency give for the agreement needing to be an AST?

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  • mn90312
    replied
    Hi, we took a full inventory when they moved in by the estate agents. The tenancy agreement clearly states AST of a single room including bills. I have served them notice but they are refusing to leave; I was hoping they would now sign a lodgers agreement so my son has more protection but that is unlikely as one of them is a lawyer and is very clued up on this. I do feel like maybe I should contact their employers as a last resort, but then again what would that change? looks like I may need to wait it out!

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  • ash72
    replied
    If you have an agreement with the 2 tenants, then you will have to wait it out. Did you perform an inventory? If so you may have a slight chance of getting their deposit, if you didn't then there is probably zero chance, also if they both say it was your son who caused the damage not sure how you will prove it.

    If you went through an agent, why don't you get them to make contact and tell them the LL has decided not to renew the contract, that's probably the only thing you can do.

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  • Snorkerz
    replied
    Just a thought, did your agreement specifically state it was an AST, or, were you perhaps tempted to try and wriggle out of by stating on the agreement that it wasn't an AST?

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