Should i be concerned? Should i evict?

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    Should i be concerned? Should i evict?

    hi all i have a large property i rent out in the east of england with a sizeable rent. Originally to a family with 5 children but father left after a domestic violence incident. I only found out after a visit from the police!. Ive contacted the mother. She wishes to stay. However i am feeling nervous.

    This is a large property with sizeable rent. family had poor credit rating and paid 1 year rent upfront. There is 4 months of this left to go the tenancy agreement. at the time i removed her ex partners name but the tenancy agreement stands for monthly rent at the end of this arrangement. Mother is self employed. I have no idea what she does, i tried to probe but she would not discuss it.

    Recently the boiler was checked. Mother let engineer in who commented there was money laying in the house. I was surprised and decided to arrange an inspection to see what i could find as it did not sound right. Mother was not obstructive. House was slightly untidy although she has preschool children. When upstairs she followed me up and just as i was starting looking around rooms she got called away downstairs to her child. I quickly looked in the office area. Mother said she did not want that area inspecting due to client data being filed there and there were several computers all with betting screens and forex on. A large balance was available in one account. I was shocked and quite horrified. It appears my tenant is paying rent from gambling.

    Have i overstepped the mark with prying. Is this illegal. Should i challenge the mother. Is my rent at risk and should i evict? What about the rent paid in advance. I feel guilty as apart from clutter house and garden well kept and she has 5 children. She appears unaware of what i saw.

    advice please landlords.

    I can't think of a specific offence - but, yes, I think that prying into someone's computer systems is certainly overstepping the mark. particularly after you had been told they contained confidential information.

    There are plenty of businesses involved in automated trading - including currencies and betting as well as shares and commodities etc.


      hi ted. Thanks for response. I maybe i am stereotyping the tenant too much as i know very little about her. my main worries is that she is now a single parent with 5 children in the house originally there was a poor credit rating. The rent is large for the area due to size of the property. My tenant is not that young. She is in her early 40s. It is true she could be involved with automated trading. Not meaning to be stereotypical again but for a single parent she has nice cars, expensive clothing and electrical items in the house and the children have 2-3 holidays a year. I know this as she does email me when away for a week. It seems like a lot of money for someone in her situation.

      I will trust when rent is due again in May she will want her children to be settled in the same house.


        You can't remove the partner's name from the tenancy agreement without their agreement.
        So they're still a tenant with rights (including access to the property) and liabilities (for the rent for example) - unless a court has ordered otherwise.

        You can't go anywhere in the property that the tenant specifically says you can't.

        And it doesn't really matter how the tenant makes their money (as long as it's legal), as long as they do.
        I'd start having the conversation about renewal now.

        When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
        Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).


          Possibly look to do rent up front again to protect your position, say you want to renew the tenancy for 6 months with payment up front. if she has plenty of cash lying around then that won't be a problem

          It sounds like she is trading on sports markets, I know plenty of people that do this and do it myself. Having plenty cash lying around is probably a case that she is using betting shops as well, because online accounts generally restrict people quite quickly

          There's nothing illegal that I can see from what you discussed, she's basically trading just like she could on a stock market but on sports markets. And if she's good at it and disciplined it can be quite lucrative


            However, in the scale of income/job security, it hardly ranks alongside accountancy or conveyancing or working in a care home, does it?

            If a tenant wrote 'gambling' as their occupation on an application form, I bet most landlords would be very wary (and not just those who find gambling distasteful). This is partly because a gambler's income is never guaranteed, but also because (obviously) gambling can be addictive (in a way that accountancy, or serving fruit and veg in Tesco, generally aren't), with the attendant loss of control. Being 'disciplined' goes out of the window pretty quickly once you're hooked on something. That isn't going to happen to everyone of course, and it could be argued that even tenants with more 'secure' jobs can lose them - although, with relatively low unemployment in this country, who would take a chance on a professional gambler when they could have a tenant with a more reliable income stream?

            'Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation fo the first link on one memorable day'. Charles Dickens, Great Expectations


              mind the gap,

              I don't disagree with that at all, I think that it can be useful as a supplemental income but it isn't reliable indefinitely, that's why I'd go rent up front. But if it was a brand new tenant I would look elsewhere and not rent to them


                hi everyone. Thanks for your input i appreciate it. The ex partner wrote to me asking for his name to be removed from tenancy as he was renting elsewhere. I spoke to her she wanted it removed. I didnt ask any further questions. she was certain she wanted to stay she likes the house and didnt want to move the children. Her occupation just says self employed. LIke i said i know little about her - i knew more about him when he was there. I assume she has another income apart from this gambling but i am not sure. i cannot imagine she would work full time somewhere. she has 2 preschool children and one who is around 6/7 plus 2 older ones.I will ask for 6 months upfront then do you think i should go to monthly after if everything seems stable? Sorry for lots of questions before these tenants i had an older couple with stable jobs so this is a bit of a learning curve.


                  You overstepped the mark, this is the problem with some landlords these days (not all of course, some are great) some seem to think they suddenly own the tenant.

                  you had no right at all to enter that room after she told you not to. It is her home not yours. Now you are trying to make a decision on information you shouldn't have known. Had there really been confidential client info in that room it could have turned into a serious data breach.

                  I can understand rent in advance to start a tenancy but surely she shouldn't have to do this again!
                  You could always issue a section21 in 2 months time to expire at end of tenancy and explain your concerns to her and tell her as long as rent paid on time etc you won't act on it. That will at least give you 4 monthly rent payments to see if she can manage before the section21 expires.


                    I think you should look to do a new AST, so that the current one with an additional person on it that is no longer there does not go periodic

                    This way you can reference the person who will be on the tenancy, and discuss her income and how she can afford it. If she cannot produce any records of self employment or proof of income you could ask for the money up front again

                    But obviously you cannot let on you know she possibly earns money the way she does as you shouldn't know


                      OP please complete & paste
                      A LL can inspect all of the demised premises if T had been served with min 24h Notice, of Inspection.
                      Yes T can decline access to whole property, but not selected demised rooms.


                        She might have just been doing match betting.. Seem like you've already made your mind up about this woman...


                          Exactly how and when did you "remove the ex-partner's name"?

                          The answer may affect the validity of any S21 or S8 notice you serve.


                            Originally posted by mariner View Post
                            Yes T can decline access to whole property, but not selected demised rooms.
                            That may well be so, but the LL should have given the T the opportunity to remove from view any confidential information before entering the room.


                              ..originally there was a poor credit rating.
                              You mention the poor credit rating a couple of times, so it seems to be a concern for you.

                              It's been said before but it's worth saying again.

                              A poor credit rating does not necessarily mean that someone can't pay their bills, it can simply mean that they don't borrow money or use credit cards.

                              If you never have any debt to pay off you will have a poor credit rating, simply because you have never had any debt to pay off.

                              The whole idea of credit rating was so that organisations considering lending to someone can see if they have paid off previous borrowing on time.
                              It's not, and was never intended to be, a general indication of someones income or trustworthiness.
                              (Although some, particularly landlords and agents, seem to have started using it as such, not realy understanding or thinking about what a credit rating actually is).

                              Unless there is a flag for non-payment, a CCJ, or some other default, I wouldn't worry too much about a poor/low CR.


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