Can I avoid paying rent on 2 properties when moving?

[bflare]

Basically, it appears that the new property will become vacant after the 15^th November. My fixed tenancy on my current place ended 5 years ago so I think I have to give a months notice. I get paid on the 25^th of each month & that’s when my current rent is paid. So, I will pay my rent as normal on the 25^th October & I plan on giving my months’ notice then which will take me to November 25^th although this is a Sunday. Ideally, I would move into my new place on the same day & continue paying my rent as normal on the 25^th when I get paid. It has been suggested that I will need to have the keys for my new place at least a week before I move in or maybe a few days so approximately 20^th November, but this would me that I would have to pay another months rent on my new place all out of the previous months wage. I do not really want to do this if possible I would rather the new tenancy start on my pay day the 25^th November. Is there anyway I can do this? Would the landlord accept one weeks rent before I sign up so from the 20^th November to 27^th & then sign up on that date? Does this happen at all? Thanks.

[jpkeates]

Your notice isn't a month, assuming you have a normal periodic tenancy, paying monthly, it needs a minimum of a month, ending at the end of a rental period.

A rental period is based on the original fixed term, and starts on the day of the month that the original fixed term began and ends on the day of the month before that.
It's usually parallel with when the rent is due but is independent of it and doesn't relate to when you actually pay at all.

So the first thing to do is establish those dates and see if they fit.

You can pretty much come to any arrangement with your landlord that you can agree between you, but if you stay after the end of the period a whole month's rent is normally due.

Your new landlord would be daft to take a week's rent and give you the keys.
They'd be daft to let you move things in before the tenancy starts.
There are lots of things that are based around the first day of the tenancy and you'd be making that a bit blurry.

There are daft landlords, though.

[bflare]

Thanks for your reply although I am still a little confused. My tenancy started on the 25th September 2012 which is also my pay day as I get paid on the 25th of each month. I did not renew my fixed tenancy agreement after the initial 6 months & my agreement says due to this I am required to give a minimum one months notice to terminate the tenancy This should be submitted in line with your tenancy period. For example if your tenancy commenced on the 10th of the month, the period will expire on the 9th, therefore your notice must be in writing and received by the Agent before the 10th of the month and you can leave on the 9^th.

This is my terms:

Term of Tenancy.

The Landlord lets to the Tenant the Premises for a period of six months. The Tenancy shall start on and include the 25 September 2012 and shall end on and include the 24 March 2013. The Tenant shall pay to the Landlord or the Agent £495.00 per month, ("the Rent") payable in advance. The first payment shall be made on the 25 September 2012. Thereafter, payments shall be made on the25th day of each month.

Notice to terminate the tenancy

Once the fixed period has expired and you do not wish to renew or continue the tenancy on a statutory periodic basis, you are required to give a minimum one months notice to terminate the tenancy. This should be submitted in line with your tenancy period. For example if your tenancy commenced on the 10th of the month, the period will expire on the 9th, therefore your notice must be in writing and received by the Agent before the 10th of the month and you can leave on the 9th. If you are unsure about your tenancy term please refer to the main terms of this tenancy agreement, section 1 or contact your property manager.

So, if I hand notice in on the 25th October together with paying my normal months rent I should be paid until the 25th November. It looks like I will have to sign up for the new place before then, maybe the 20^th of November & stump up another months rent then which I was hoping to avoid.

[MdeB]

Moving between landlords is always a pain because

• You need both properties at the same time (unless you stick belongings in a van overnight)
• New property may not actually be available (e.g. previous tenant failed to move out and LL gambled they would)
• Deposit is needed for both properties.

You may be able to get LL to start tenancy (say) 20th with rent payable on 25th, but no sensible, law-abiding, LL would let you in without receiving the deposit and first month's rent (the lawless might, on the basis that they will 'send the boys round' if you default).

[jpkeates]

You need to serve your notice on or before the 25th October to expire on the 24th November.
Make it before to be sure, if you post it allow a couple of business days for it to arrive.

The legislation that created the periodic tenancy when the initial term ended (the Housing Act 1988) also made any notice period in the original contract void.
However, the text of the paragraph does actually describe the position correctly.

[bflare]

MdeB,

Yeah, I can see the pain it is going to cause me. The bond is not an issue I have that saved up & the bond from my current place could be used for the first months rent on the new place if I have to pay before I get paid which I am trying to avoid. If I pay up until the 25th November on my current property which is a Sunday would I be able to move into the new place on the Monday 26th November & pay the deposit & first month’s rent then? Would my old LL / estate agent allow me to stay at my property on the Sunday (25^th) even though from my agreement it appears I should have to be out on the 24^th November? Both properties are fully furnished so I have little possessions apart from clothes & kitchen utensils etc.

[MdeB]

Thanks for your reply although I am still a little confused

That is because you provided insufficient information initially: only when you pay not the date of the tenancy start.

So, if I hand notice in on the 25th October

Then your notice will not end the tenancy in November.
To terminate at end of 24 November (you can only end tenancy at end of 24th of a month), your notice must be received on or before 24 October.

Note that notice requirement is "at lest one month", not "exactly one month".
Note also that notice is considered served only on a working day unless handed to the recipient; if you post it first class, then you need to allow two working days for delivery.

[bflare]

jpkeates,

How soon before can I serve my notice? If my tenancy ends on the 24^th which is a Saturday would it be likely that the LL would allow me to stay in the flat until the 25^th so return the keys on the 26^th which is a Monday? Also because I get paid on the 25^th of each month & in November it is a Sunday my wage will get paid into my bank on the Friday 23^rd so I could actually start the tenancy on the new place then & I would have the cash. But then ask for the subsequent payments to be taken out on the 25^th of each month or after. Would this be allowed? Can you move rent payment dates?

[bflare]

That is because you provided insufficient information initially: only when you pay not the date of the tenancy start

Apologies for this.

Then your notice will not end the tenancy in November.
To terminate at end of 24 November (you can only end tenancy at end of 24th of a month), your notice must be received on or before 24 October.

So basically I am planning on handing my notice in at the estate agent or post it as you suggested & I must do this so they receive it before the 24th October & I will need to be out of the property by 24th November which is a Saturday? How likely is it that I could move into my new property on the 24th & pay for the first months rent / deposit then change the payment dates for the subsequent months to 25th November or after.

[MdeB]

the bond from my current place could be used for the first months rent on the new place

You are unlikely to get deposit back in under a week: current landlord needs to make sure that you have not caused loss or damage before it is returned.

However, if

• both properties are via the same agent
• you have been a model tenant
• an inspection visit is held shortly before the end of the tenancy

then the agent may agree that the deposit can be transferred to the new tenancy.

If I pay up until the 25th November on my current property which is a Sunday would I be able to move into the new place on the Monday 26th November & pay the deposit & first month’s rent then?

No reputable agent would allow this because it could put them and the landlord in a poor position IF you failed to vacate.

[theartfullodger]

Rather more here...
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com....php?t=5907809

[bflare]

Rather more here...
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com....php?t=5907809

Is there a problem with me asking the same question on 2 different sites? With this being a more specific site I assumed I would get a more information & help that I may not get on a more generalised site.

[theartfullodger]

Free country: (well, up to a point...)

[bflare]

Free country: (well, up to a point...)

I am sorry for asking the same question on another site & if it appears that I am just trying to get away with not having to pay 2 amounts of rent which some people may say I should have had saved but it is a difficult situation. I was not expecting having to move but my elderly father is moving back to the UK due to ill health & I am having to look after him & this is why I am moving & why it is so quick. I am a single man with an 11 year old boy & money is not good at the moment. I have managed to save the deposit up in a short period of time but he possibility of having to pay 2 amounts of rent in one month just before Christmas is a little worrying & this is why I am asking you good people some advice. If I do not move by the end of November I will be in a one bed apartment with my son & father who mobility is extremely bad.

[MdeB]

How soon before can I serve my notice?

You can serve it any time, provided at least 1 month and ending on the right day.
You can serve it 6 months or more in advance if you really want to.

Also because I get paid on the 25th of each month & in November it is a Sunday my wage will get paid into my bank on the Friday 23rd so I could actually start the tenancy on the new place then & I would have the cash. But then ask for the subsequent payments to be taken out on the 25th of each month or after. Would this be allowed?

you can try to agree anything with LL/agent, but success is a different issue.

& I will need to be out of the property by 24th November which is a Saturday?

No later than midnight at the end of 24th.

How likely is it that I could move into my new property on the 24th

probably not very, as it is a weekend.

& pay for the first months rent / deposit then change the payment dates for the subsequent months to 25th November or after.

You might be able to persuade LL/agent to add a couple of days on to the start of the tenancy for free; if it is empty, then no loss to LL.
Something like:

• Term: 6 months and 3 days starting 22 November.
• Rent: £x per month in advance; first payment due on 22 November before possession is granted; subsequent payment due 25th each month.