2 Bed House, Let our Each Floor Separately

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    2 Bed House, Let our Each Floor Separately

    I have a 2 bed house with parking and garage in Morden area which can be let out for £1200 which has to target small families.

    I would like to be able to rent out ground floor and first floor separately with two different Assured Shorthold Tenancy agreements then in that case ground floor could be rented out for £650 and first floor as £850 so in total it becomes like £1500 rather than £1200, £300 more per month (£3.6k per annum) and targeting young professionals rather than families.

    On the ground floor I have a kitchen, bathroom and a lounge which can be treated as a Studio flat. Upstrairs, there is a bathroom and 2 bedrooms at the moment that I'm looking to make one of the bedrooms as a kitchen then it becomes a 1 bed flat.


    The entrance of the building would be just one but internally there are 2 doors, One which goes to the ground floor studio flat and the other at the top of the stairs for the first floor 1 bed flat.

    So,

    1)

    do I need planning permission/building regulation to install a kitchen upstairs and an additional door upstairs and rent out the floors separately?

    Not to be illegal but just if possible, I would like to avoid going through planning permission and building regulations since I wouldn't like to split the titles, just to be able to rent out the floors separately.

    2)
    What about the electricity meter? gas meter? council tax? water bills? internet? telephone? boiler?

    I'm thinking to rent out each floor as all-bills included so that I don't have to separate them as they could become quite expensive. And just add e.g. £100 on top of each rent.

    Would that be legal? could it be perceived as house share? sharing bills mainly and garden. I could let the tenants know that it's a kind of house share but just independent floors let out..

    3)
    I'm going to install fire alarm, smoke alarm, fire doors, etc for each floor.

    Noise would usually be acceptable if it's perceived as a house share but if perceived as a separate flat then I'd need to also think about sound proofing ceilings from the ground floor.


    I'd really appreciate your advice/opinion.

    #2
    Presumably there's no mortgage, so ignoring any lender issues.

    You will need planning permission (and your local plan may not allow the development).
    There may well be a "planning gain" fee.
    Council tax will need to be addressed.

    There will almost certainly be a need for building regulation approval.

    The utility companies may object, as a domestic supply may not be sufficient/appropriate for two separate households.

    Insurance will need looking at.

    I would (personally) never rent any property including utility bills - but that's a minor issue.
    When I post, I am expressing an opinion - feel free to disagree, I have been wrong before.
    Please don't act on my suggestions without checking with a grown-up (ideally some kind of expert).

    Comment


      #3
      1. I expect your local authority will take the attitude that if you create a new kitchen you create a new home and therefore council tax is payable on another unit. You will need planning consent for change of use of 1 house to 2 flats. Most councils especially in London suburbs are against this type of thing. Building regs would be necessary on for at least noise and safety grounds.
      I'm sure your neighbours will be only too happy to inform the council if you choose not to get consent. I know I would.

      2. Sounds like a recipe for disaster - don't do it.

      3. If you got consent a hard wired fire/smoke/ poss co2 alarm would be part of the consent. Not battery powered stuff.



      Freedom at the point of zero............

      Comment


        #4
        You need to find the 'double the rent' thread that was in here.
        "I'm afraid I didn't do enough background checks apart from checking her identity on Facebook" - ANON

        What I say is based on my own experience and research - Please don't take as gospel without first checking the gospel yourself.

        Comment


          #5
          If you manage to have it done, and you have 2 different renters, would the renters get on or do you get loads of grief from both of them.
          There is also the total cost of separating the floors into separate apartments, how long would it take to recoup the cost?
          Personally, I wouldn't do it
          Another long suffering LandLord

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by NewAdventure View Post
            I*I'm thinking to rent out each floor as all-bills included so that I don't have to separate them as they could become quite expensive.
            Provision of free energy would become expensive. If I was a tenant it would be shorts and Tshirt / underware temperature in the house 24/7.
            "I'm afraid I didn't do enough background checks apart from checking her identity on Facebook" - ANON

            What I say is based on my own experience and research - Please don't take as gospel without first checking the gospel yourself.

            Comment


              #7
              with an estimated cost of conversion around 15k, you would get that back in 5 years, though of course you now have twice as many things to wrong, so it might be six or seven years JUST to break even, and even longer if you let them use whatever energy they want, whenever they want?

              I've got a better plan, loan me the 15k and I will give it all back to you in ten years, at least you know you will get your money back!

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jpkeates View Post
                Presumably there's no mortgage, so ignoring any lender issues.
                There is going to be a mortgage, why should they care? it'd be just like a house share renting.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by jpkeates View Post

                  You will need planning permission (and your local plan may not allow the development).
                  There may well be a "planning gain" fee.
                  Council tax will need to be addressed.

                  There will almost certainly be a need for building regulation approval.

                  I would (personally) never rent any property including utility bills - but that's a minor issue.
                  I spoke to an experienced Architect and I've got in email writing from him that I don't need planning permission or building reg approval, to add just a Kitchen and bathroom.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    All these issues are true and I dont' deny:
                    @Council issues
                    @Planning permission/Building Regs
                    @Tenants getting along with each other well or not
                    @Excessive Use of energy
                    @Tenants may leave early as it may not be that comfortable

                    But they exist in any house share also, right? this is just a house share with a bit more privacy.

                    And they are many people who're house sharing.

                    So the choice is between less hassle/less money or high risk of hassle/more money?

                    I want the least hassle and most money, who doesn't!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by NewAdventure View Post
                      I spoke to an experienced Architect and I've got in email writing from him that I don't need planning permission or building reg approval, to add just a Kitchen and bathroom.
                      He's wrong. You are creating a new dwelling, ie 1 divided into 2, therefore full planning permission is required.

                      As you are creating 2 dwellings building regulations apply to the separation of those dwellings particulalry with respect to fire escape routes and sound control between dwellings. They will also want to know about individual dwellings 'amenity space' and car parking arrangements.

                      Sorry to appear negative but that is fact.

                      If you go ahead without either of the above permissions you are breaking the law, firstly planning law and secondly building regulations. Both are law in England and Wales.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I agree with the point above. You think you're being clever but the reality is your proposals are to clearly create two separate dwellings not a house share.

                        The architect is correct that you don't need Planning Consent to install a second kitchen within a single dwelling. As I read your posts, this is not what your proposing (see the last paragraph).

                        Building Regulations are a different matter. Installing a kitchen would have ventialtion, utility services, drainage and fire compartmentation implications to name a few. I don't see how it wouldn't be a notifiable job.

                        Frankly, I don't see the rise in rent / yield being sufficient to offset the required investment.

                        This sort of work can be worth it. I'm currently doing a conversion where the cost of conversion will be redeemed within 6-months of renting.
                        There is always scope for misinterpretation.

                        If my posts can be interpreted in two ways, one that makes you feel angry and one that doesn't, I meant the latter.

                        Everyday is an opportunity to learn something new.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by mk1fan View Post
                          This sort of work can be worth it. I'm currently doing a conversion where the cost of conversion will be redeemed within 6-months of renting.
                          I've seen people who have done it but in their own home which is easier to manage.

                          I'm convinced it's too much hassle and risk so I'm going to refurbish it as a one unit of 2 bed house and rent it out.

                          I'd be interested in knowing how it can properly be converted into 2 flats, how much it'd cost and how long it'd take?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by NewAdventure View Post
                            There is going to be a mortgage, why should they care? it'd be just like a house share renting.
                            Haha. Forget about it. You need to get permission from the mortgagee before you can change anything with the flat and they will charge you quite a bit of money for even considering it. And I have a strong feeling they will then not accept it, for the reasons which were outlined to you earlier.

                            You're flogging a dead horse on this if you have a mortgagee.

                            Comment

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