is it okay to have a bedroom with no window

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  • is it okay to have a bedroom with no window

    Hi there, I searched the forum and couldnt find my answer so apologies if this has already been asked.

    I have put an offer on a one bedroom flat that we wish to convert into a 2 bedroom flat and the only way we can see that happening is to split the living room/kitchen and use space from there. Only problem is that there would not be a window to the outside, however it is a 3.4m floor to ceiling height and there is a big window in the living room so I was planning to have windows at the top of the wall letting light in. Just wondering if this would be allowed as I have not seen anything conclusive so far and wondered if someone could help here.

    I have attached a floorplan, a very basic image to show what we want to do from our thoughts. If its a total no go to do that then it gives us the choice to back out of the purchase. I am not sure if the image will come up on this thread, I tried to attach but not sure if it allowed me to

    Many thanks

    Sandy

  • #2
    Best to contact your local council building control department.

    I think ventilation provision is key here, rather then light.

    You also have a the problem of access to a room through another room which can be seen as a fire risk, depending on your situation. There would be no escape from the bedroom though a window if there was a fire in the lounge.

    Even if it could officially be a bedroom, would it be desirable when you come to sell?
    All posts in good faith, but do not rely on them

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    • #3
      Ignoring the window.( but probably don't need one )

      You cannot waltz into Leasehold flat and start knocking walls down.

      You will have to get permission from the freeholder FIRST.
      You may buy the flat only to find out freeholder does not give
      permission.

      The freeholder will, must and is entitled to employ a surveyor to
      look over your plans, and give comment.
      The cost for this is payble by you.
      After all the investigation by the freeholder, they can still
      refuse permission.
      The building and walls are not yours to alter.

      ( You rent the rooms for the period of the lease. You have not
      bought the flat, but leased it, assuming it's leasehold )

      R.a.M.

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      • #4
        Ah I see very useful advice, thank you so much. I asked the estate agent who called the landlord and they said in this would be okay for us to change the configuration. There is a way we can have the bedroom leading straight into the hallway. Maybe this would help with the fire safety. Seems like it wont be straightforward and we will only do it if we can make a nice room. Thanks again for your time and advice, it really is so useful.

        Sandy

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        • #5
          No. You need a window.

          Read Approved Doc B - Fire

          Criteria for means of escape
          B1.xi The basic principles for the design of means of escape are:
          a. that there should be alternative means ofescape from most situations;
          b. where direct escape to a place of safety is not possible, it should be possible to reach a place of relative safety, such as a protected
          stairway, which is on a route to an exit, within a reasonable travel distance. In such cases the means of escape will consist of two parts,
          the first being unprotected in accommodation and circulation areas, and the second in protected stairways (and in some circumstances
          protected corridors).

          You also need to have passive and / or mechanical ventillation.

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          • #6
            Hi, thank you so much for pointing that out. I think its better not to go with that floorplan based on the feedback. We are looking at a way which is a lot more work but will ensure the bedroom has a window. I will contact a local architect to run through some ideas.

            Thanks so much for the helpful advice.

            Sandy

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            • #7
              Sandy,

              Where are you located? I work as an Architectural Technician if interested.

              Simon

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              • #8
                Hi Simon,

                Thanks, We are based in Battersea SW London.

                Sandy

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                • #9
                  No you need to have a window, I was recently made to change a bedroom into a kitchen making the flat I owned look ridiculous but the council insisted

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                  • #10
                    Ok so I have found a way to do it by sharing one very large window for two rooms, and I am not sure if anyone here would have the knowledge here or not.
                    The building is grade II listed (it was a former school) converted to apartments some 7 years ago. The apartment itself has no features at all. Its all plasterboards floor to ceiling and the landlord said its okay to knock anything down internally. The outside of the building is what I assume is listed. I have a large arch window about 3m wide if not bigger and I would have to put a wall between the window and I was thinking I would do a partition wall say upto 1/2 a meter before the window and from that point to the actual window have a frosted glass panel so that from the outside you wouldnt see a stud wall through the window. Some of the windows from the outside have curtains and some have plantation shutters so I dont think its like they care too much what we do to the windows as long as we dont change the window itself. I know I am reaching here as you havent seen the place so hard to imagine, but if anyone has any knowledge of grade II listed buildings that refer more to the facade I imagine and if they can visualise what I have written might give some advice :-)

                    Much thanks

                    Sandy

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                    • #11
                      Our council say you have to have a window. But if you have a room with no window ie a study or storage area, you don't know if the T is using it as a bedroom so it's out of your hands.

                      BTW the opening of the window has to be a certain percentage of the area of the floor space, I think, so perhaps somebody with building reg knowledge can expand on that.

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                      • #12
                        Grade 2 listed buildings: I used to live in one and thought that the original features had to be preserved. After we moved out the next people knocked down about 6' of the chimney and didn't replace a lower sash window that had blown in during a gale.

                        I phoned somewhere, and I can't remember where but they deal with listed buildings (sorry), and they said that with a G2 you only don't have to knock it down!

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                        • #13
                          If the property is listed its likely you need listed building consent. Your heritage officer in the planning dept of your local council can help you; maybe for a fee
                          All posts in good faith, but do not rely on them

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                          You can search the forums here:

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Berlingogirl View Post
                            Grade 2 listed buildings: I used to live in one and thought that the original features had to be preserved. After we moved out the next people knocked down about 6' of the chimney and didn't replace a lower sash window that had blown in during a gale.

                            I phoned somewhere, and I can't remember where but they deal with listed buildings (sorry), and they said that with a G2 you only don't have to knock it down!
                            It's the LA Conservation Officer, and whoever said that is having a larf, or is perhaps on goose juice.

                            This to a Grade 2 Listed Rectory:

                            Mr Powell and Mr Tibbles pleaded guilty to charges relating to the unauthorised removal of several internal brick partitions, inserting new doorways and removal of a ground floor flight of stairs.; The alterations were significant involving the irreversible loss of historic fabric from the listed building that is of national importance and listed in the nation's interest.;
                            Cost them 20k in fines and costs.

                            http://www.maldon.gov.uk/news/articl...ul_prosecution

                            And there's a league table here:
                            http://www.charles-church.org.uk/ProsecutionTable1.pdf

                            Highest fine is 200k. That *was* for demolition, 1 day after a spot listing.

                            ML
                            Refer Mad Regulators to Arkell vs Pressdram.

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