Can planners ask me to demolish my annexe ?

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    Can planners ask me to demolish my annexe ?

    We are purchasing a property which has an attached annexe. When I checked the planning permisions I found that outline planning was granted in 1978 for this annexe but on the condition that it contained a caravan site office and was not exclusivley residential.

    Since then the property has been separated from the caravan park and the annexe is being used just for residential purposes.

    My question is "can the planning dept ask us to demolish or modify this extension given that it was built in 1980 ? " as it does not comply with their origianl conditions.

    Many thanks

    #2
    Yes, they can ask.
    There is always scope for misinterpretation.

    If my posts can be interpreted in two ways, one that makes you feel angry and one that doesn't, I meant the latter.

    Everyday is an opportunity to learn something new.

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      #3
      And if they did ask would we have to comply ?

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        #4
        Automatic planning permission

        You may have a lawful use by virtue of the passage of time of CONTINUOUS use... 4 years for residential, 10 years for all other uses, breaches of planning permission and building works.

        Peter

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          #5
          Thanks it has been used as residential for over thirty years so I am assuming we would be ok ?

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            #6
            The current owner needs to prove the contiuous use which can be easy or hard depending on the specific circumstances.
            There is always scope for misinterpretation.

            If my posts can be interpreted in two ways, one that makes you feel angry and one that doesn't, I meant the latter.

            Everyday is an opportunity to learn something new.

            Comment


              #7
              You may want to read through section 171B of the Town and Country Planning Act which explains that enforcement action against a breach of planning control cannot be undertaken after the number of years mentioned by the previous poster.

              Once those time limits have been passed, the use of the property becomes lawful.
              It is then possible to resolve matters by making an application for a Certificate of Lawful Use or Development by paying a standard fee.
              The Certificate has to be issued based on matters of fact and the planning office cannot make any decision based on whether they like the development or not.
              They have to answer the legal question "is it too late for enforcement action"
              If proof is provided that it is too late, the certificate will confirm to any prospective purchaser that all is now legal.
              171B Time limits.
              (1)Where there has been a breach of planning control consisting in the carrying out without planning permission of building, engineering, mining or other operations in, on, over or under land, no enforcement action may be taken after the end of the period of four years beginning with the date on which the operations were substantially completed.
              (2)Where there has been a breach of planning control consisting in the change of use of any building to use as a single dwellinghouse, no enforcement action may be taken after the end of the period of four years beginning with the date of the breach.
              (3)In the case of any other breach of planning control, no enforcement action may be taken after the end of the period of ten years beginning with the date of the breach.
              (4)The preceding subsections do not prevent—
              (a)the service of a breach of condition notice in respect of any breach of planning control if an enforcement notice in respect of the breach is in effect; or
              (b)taking further enforcement action in respect of any breach of planning control if, during the period of four years ending with that action being taken, the local planning authority have taken or purported to take enforcement action in respect of that breach.”

              Comment


                #8
                Many thanks for your help. We know it has been used solely for residential purposes for the last 30 years. However proving that may be difficult as the previous owner who we are purchasing from is deceased.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by brook22 View Post
                  Many thanks for your help. We know it has been used solely for residential purposes for the last 30 years. However proving that may be difficult as the previous owner who we are purchasing from is deceased.
                  Perhaps you could find out if the previous owner of the premises has been paying domestic council tax, check with the electoral register to see if whoever has been living their has been registered to vote, check with the land registry to see if it has been registered as a seperate address, if you are buying the place off the deceased family you might be able to get "Sworn Statements" that their relative lived their for a number of years or some of the family went their on holidays. To make sure you dont make a mistake you should employ a (RTPI)Chartered Town Planner to look into it for you, perhaps with the view to making an application for a Certificate of Lawful Development, he or she will advise as to what third party evidence would be required. And with respect I would not ask the council, let your RTPI decide if they need consulting. IT would surely be better if you were to make a Lawful Development application that it would be "out of the blue" for the council.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    You need to have the proof of use in place and confirmed by the Council before you commit to purchase, or you may be buying a can of worms.

                    Or you can take the risk.

                    ML
                    Refer Mad Regulators to Arkell vs Pressdram.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      When you posed the original question, the answer was that the Local Planning Authority could serve an Enforcement Notice of you claiming that there had been a breach of planning control because the condition imposed in 1980 has not been complied with.

                      To remedy the breach of planning control they could ask that you cease using the annexe for residential purposes.
                      They cannot ask that the annexe be demolished because the four year period to enforce against operational development (an actual building) has long passed.

                      It is always possible to appeal an enforcement notice, but based on practical experience of the planning system for over 40 years, the chances of the planners seeking to do something about this annexe is virtually nil.

                      It would not be worth worrying about, because there will be lots of evidence that the caravan operation was separated off years earlier. As long as your obtain evidence of more than 10 years use for residential purposes you should be confident that there will be no possibility of that change of use not being accepted.

                      It is certainly a very minor breach of planning control that is unlikely to raise any problems with the local planning authority.

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                        #12
                        Thanks, we now have confirmation from the council that they are happy with the property as it is and we can now proceed to purchase. Many thanks all of you for your help with this matter.

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                          #13
                          Please can member PILMAN contact me

                          Hi. Please excuse me cos not sure if Iam allowed to do this, but I would be very grateful if member PILMAN could contact me. My email address is tim.tribute@sky.com. Thanks Tim

                          Comment


                            #14
                            On a similar issue however, I have found that the above did not work out quite as indicated above. I am claiming that under the new Core Strategy that I should not have to pay contributions because I am demolishing an annexe that was separated from the existing house on the site in 1998 and accordingly I am demolishing an existing dwelling. In applying for an LDC I submitted sworn statements from the previous owners confirming that they separated the 2 buildings back in 1998 and they have been separate ever since (altho with shared utility services) The annex from this time even had its own access from the boundary, its own side and back door entrances, own kitchen and bathroom etc. - totally independent. My LPA refused my LDC and they are now taking enforcement against me to re-instate it back into the main house??? So an LDC is not automatic or have they in fact acted unlawfully?

                            Comment

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