My garages are demised to adjoining house- sue lessees?

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    #16
    This is fun by the way

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      #17
      Originally posted by dominic View Post
      “dwelling” means a building or part of a building occupied or intended to be occupied as a separate dwelling together with any yard, garden, outhouses and appurtenances belonging to it or usually enjoyed with it;

      My emphasis added.
      I agree. "Dwelling" means either a building or part-building, with or without appurtenances. However, this pre-supposes that T has a lease of dwelling with garage. He doesn't, here- only a lease of garage. No matter what you say, a garage isn't a dwelling.
      JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
      1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
      2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
      3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
      4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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        #18
        Where in the LTA 1985 or elsewhere is this pre-supposition?

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          #19
          Originally posted by dominic View Post
          Where in the LTA 1985 or elsewhere is this pre-supposition?
          It follows from logic.
          Let A = residence and B = appurtenaces.
          Dwelling = A together with any B.
          So dwelling can be:
          i. A on its own; or
          ii. A + B.
          Dwelling cannot be B on its own.
          Proof: what if A (residence) were to be freehold? Where then stands your argument?
          JEFFREY SHAW, solicitor [and Topic Expert], Nether Edge Law*
          1. Public advice is believed accurate, but I accept no legal responsibility except to direct-paying private clients.
          2. Telephone advice: see http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=34638.
          3. For paid advice about conveyancing/leaseholds/L&T, contact me* and become a private client.
          4. *- Contact info: click on my name (blue-highlight link).

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            #20
            What about this logic:

            18. Meaning of “service charge” and “relevant costs”.

            (1) In the following provisions of this Act “service charge” means an amount payable by a tenant of a dwelling as part of or in addition to the rent:
            (a) which is payable, directly or indirectly, for services, repairs, maintenance or insurance or the landlord’s costs of management, and
            (b) the whole or part of which varies or may vary according to the relevant costs.

            So the test is:

            a. Is the house together with the garage a dwelling under the LTA 1985?(there is no requirement in the definition that these have to be under the same title, or indeed that if more than one title, all titles must be a leasehold interest. The garage simply has to "belong to the house" or be "usually enjoyed by it"). Yes

            b. Is there a service charge payable in realtion to that dwelling? Yes

            c. Is that service charge payable by a tenant of that dwelling? Yes.
            Last edited by dominic; 09-07-2009, 14:37 PM. Reason: for sense.

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              #21
              Originally posted by dominic View Post
              What about this logic:

              18. Meaning of “service charge” and “relevant costs”.

              (1) In the following provisions of this Act “service charge” means an amount payable by a tenant of a dwelling as part of or in addition to the rent:
              (a) which is payable, directly or indirectly, for services, repairs, maintenance or insurance or the landlord’s costs of management, and
              (b) the whole or part of which varies or may vary according to the relevant costs.

              So the test is:

              a. Is the house together with the garage a dwelling under the LTA 1985?(there is no requirement in the definition that these have to be under the same title, or indeed that if more than one title, all titles must be a leasehold interest. The garage simply has to "belong to the house" or be "usually enjoyed by it"). Yes

              b. Is there a service charge payable in realtion to that dwelling? Yes

              c. Is that service charge payable by a tenant of that dwelling? Yes.
              Jeffrey - you're right. Point c does not pass.

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