Registration of notice fee

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    #16
    If the clause stated the fee, I doubt it could be challenged since you agreed to a contract including the fee. Lease terms do not need to be reasonable.

    However, in your case, there is a debate to be decided and that is how much is "reasonable". Personally, I would pay the £40, Under Protest, with a covering letter pointing out you do not consider the fee reasonable per the lease term and asking the landlord to explain the basis for their calculation.

    It really is not worth giving the landlord an opportunity to load other charges (legal fees etc.) for £40. There is a principle, I understand this, but perhaps at this stage leaving a future challenge open might be a better option.

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      #17
      Ref post number 1. and answer at 13

      Make sure there is not another covenant somewhere else that says permision to sublet must be obtained, as what you need to find is not always on the same page, previous or following page, or same section.


      Comment


        #18
        Thank you vmart and Ram I have just been trawling through and found a case by the FTT where the notice came under
        1. The applicant seeks a determination pursuant to section 168 (4) of the Commonhold and Leasehold Reform Act 2002 (the 2002 Act) that the respondents have breached clause 3(7) and (8) of the Flat lease. The application arises from an assignment of the lease on 24 April 2017. It is alleged that the respondents failed to:
          1. enter into a deed of covenant with the applicant, arising from the
        lease assignment;
        1. give notice of assignment and pay a registration fee to the
        applicant; and
        1. provide the applicant with a verified copy of the relevant transfer deed.
        The FTT found they were in breach of the lease? The Tribunal’s decision

        12. The Tribunal determines that the respondents have breached covenants in the lease by failing to:
        1. enter into a deed of covenant with the applicant, as required by
        clause 3(7);
        1. give notice of assignment and pay the registration fee to the applicant within four weeks of the lease assignment (or at all), as required by clause 3(8);
        2. deliver to the applicant a verified copy of the transfer deed dated 24 April 2017 within four weeks of the lease assignment (or at all), as required by clause 3(8).
        Reasons for the Tribunal’s decision

        1. The respondents have not contested the application and the Tribunal accepts the contents of applicant’s statement of case, which is supported by the official copies of the lease and recent Land Registry entries for the Flat.
        2. It is clear from the Land Registry entries that the respondents purchased the Flat on 24 April 2017. This transaction involved an assignment of the lease. The respondents have not entered into a deed of covenant with the applicant. Further, they have not provided the applicant with a notice of assignment, the registration fee or a verified
        copy of the transfer deed. The documents and fee were due by 22 May 2017, being four weeks from the date of the respondents’ purchase. The next steps

        1. The Tribunal has determined that the respondents have breached the lease.
        2. The respondents should remedy the breach, as soon as possible, if they are to avoid further action by the applicant. That action could include service of a notice under section 146 of the Law of Property Act 1925 and possible Court proceedings to forfeit the lease and repossess

        Comment


          #19
          The case you cite is about breach of lease. To clarify my point was the FTT do not have jurisdiction to determine transfer fees. These are neither a service or administration charge under CLRA 2002.

          However, given the decision above, I can only repeat, pay the £40.

          Comment


            #20
            Thank you for all your help

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by eagle2 View Post
              The lease does not require you to seek the freeholder's permission to sublet, it only requires you to notify the freeholder or its solicitors after the event and pay a reasonable registration fee. The problem with paying £10 is that the freeholder will most likely carry forward the unpaid balance and claim that there are unpaid arrears when you wish to sell.
              But that is sort of suggesting that any sum can be demanded and potentially remain owing.

              The way to proceed is never to ask what the fee is.

              A. If the lease states a specific sum pay that and there can be no argument.

              B. If it says pay a reasonable fee pay £10.

              C. It it says pay £x or a reasonable fee pay £x unless you think £x is unreasonable in which case pay what you think is reasonable. If you pay £x there can be no argument as you have the choice of paying (a) £x or (b) a reasonable fee.

              D. If it says to pay a reasonable fee being not less than £x, or to like effect, pay £x.

              If the landlord or agent considers a reasonable fee to be more than you have paid ask him to show it is reasonable. Until the amount of the fee has been quantified in some way it is not due.

              Comment


                #22
                Thank you Law cruncher that's a good point so could I offer £0

                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Starlane View Post
                  Thank you Law cruncher that's a good point so could I offer £0
                  If you don't think services include items as listed in post number 12, then offer £ 0

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Lawcruncher - That is the problem in a nutshell, these freeholders do think that they can charge anything and bully leaseholders into paying the unreasonable amounts. There needs to be legislation to put a stop to it.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by ram View Post

                      If you don't think services include items as listed in post number 12, then offer £ 0
                      I very much doubt that the freeholder has provided the service described in #12 but in any case, according to the information supplied to us at #1 the freeholder is not entitled to charge anything other than a "reasonable sum for the registration of ..(the).. notice". Putting clauses such as that into leases is particularly unhelpful because there will be many different opinions on what is considered to be reasonable.

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Starlane View Post
                        Thank you Law cruncher that's a good point so could I offer £0
                        Don't make an offer, just send an amount and await events. You have to pay something as clearly £0 is not a fee at all.

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                          #27
                          As RAM has been saying in his posts it depends on how much work is required to preform the service, however it would seem the freeholder is entitled to charge according to this clause and it comes down to what is reasonable and as you say Eagle2 " this is subjective"

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by Starlane View Post
                            As RAM has been saying in his posts it depends on how much work is required to preform the service
                            Not really, because the fee is expressed to be for registering the notice and nothing else.

                            Comment


                              #29
                              So to read this and do some of the work such as the freeholder contacting the Managing agent who is letting the property and view/read the AST would take some time possibly?

                              Comment


                                #30
                                I have a similar lease clause and my freeholder is one of the most litigious in the Country but I have never paid their fee in 21 years of letting. They used to send speculative demands every now and then but don't even bother with that anymore
                                How on earth would they know if and when I grant a lease on my flat ??

                                To say the Freeholder needs to know the number of residents for fire purposes is ridiculous - how would they ever know how many people are in a family....lol

                                Comment

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