Can a situation exist where a property also owns the leasehold?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Can a situation exist where a property also owns the leasehold?

    I don't know how best to explain this, but will give it a go...

    I live in a leasehold property which is the first floor of a purpose built block of two (i.e. not a converted house). The ground floor property is owned by the freeholder.

    Can there ever be a situation whereby the ground floor property is not leasehold, but is the freehold as well?

    I have checked land registry (and would be happy to share) for the ground floor property and the title that I get when I pay my £3 is for the freehold for both buildings. In the section for "schedule of notice of leases" there is the information about my lease, but nothing for the ground floor property.

    In this situation I would have expected to see a freehold (owned by the landlord) and then two leaseholds under the notice of leases (which I hold and one which the freeholder or another of his companies owns).

    Have I missed something?


    #2
    It is very common. Most ex-council blocks will be like this, unless everyone has exercised right to buy.

    Comment


      #3
      Thank you for your reply – so, if I may in my own situation, is there only one leaseholder and one freeholder (but two properties)?

      Does this mean that I could force a sale of half of the freehold for example via enfranchisement (100% of the leaseholders would want this to happen, i.e. me) or am I missing something?
      Last edited by manchesterpat; 16-07-2019, 13:27 PM. Reason: confused leaseholder and freeholder in my reply

      Comment


        #4
        You meant 100% of the long leaseholders, I presume. I'm not sufficiently familiar with the edge cases of the law, but it would clearly be unfair to the existing freeholder if this were allowed.

        Can you actually force a purchase in this case. I would have thought you only had first refusal rights, as the whole building is not your house.

        Comment


          #5
          Thanks again for your reply.

          Unfortunately I have missed the boat on the first refusal - the property was transferred from the freeholder (own name) to a company in April 2017, which I found out about because I got an invoice with a new name. I thought the freeholder could do whatever he wanted with his property and never challenged this, and I think I only have 4 months from when I found this out to challenge this.

          Comment


            #6
            If as you say the property is not a conversion and is a purpose built block then it seems you have the right to enfranchise. This means you will own 100% of the freehold. The freeholder will have the right to a 999 year leaseback for their flat.

            Are there any communal areas? Commercial areas?

            May I ask your motivation for considering enfranchisement. Are you looking to extend your lease? Or perhaps you are not happy with the management?



            Comment


              #7
              Thank you for your reply vmart - could you point me in a direction where I can read more about this?

              I think I have answered my own question about enfranchisement as the property doesn't qualify - two thirds of the properties in the block are not owned by qualifying tenants, only one (mine) as the other isn't on a lease, so it's only half of the properties in the block.

              Comment

              Latest Activity

              Collapse

              • Priorities for Leasehold Reform
                eagle2
                In no particular order
                All service charge monies must be held in a separate client bank account, someone eg the regulator should carry out random checks that it is being held correctly
                All reserve fund monies must be held in a separate client bank deposit account, monies paid in immediately...
                25-07-2019, 09:20 AM
              • Reply to Priorities for Leasehold Reform
                eagle2
                I do not hate everything leasehold at all, I just want a fair deal for leaseholders.

                At present, there is much which is wrong, which needs to be addressed. The vultures who abuse the system by inflating costs for their own benefit at the expense of leaseholders need to be stopped. The vultures...
                23-08-2019, 08:30 AM
              • are online surveys allowed to be used to poll / vote in RMC / RTM?
                Fred22
                My flats have people i'm sure who live away. Neighbours can't confirm who is renting or leaseholder. It's a RMC. It got me thinking about votes of the members and how to get them. An online survey seemed practical (we do it at work). Has anyone know if a survey can be used as a way of voting for things,...
                22-08-2019, 19:11 PM
              • Reply to are online surveys allowed to be used to poll / vote in RMC / RTM?
                eagle2
                I agree that everyone must be allowed to participate and that is the problem, not everyone has access to online facilities .Some people actually prefer the old fashioned idea of meeting and speaking to members.
                23-08-2019, 07:44 AM
              • Reply to Priorities for Leasehold Reform
                ram
                Putting aside your utter hate of anything leasehold.

                Directors of ANY Limited company, are there to make the decisions.
                If you want all leaseholders to decide on things, you make them all directors ( and don't come back saying they can all vote as leaseholders at a meeting convened
                ...
                23-08-2019, 07:40 AM
              • Reply to are online surveys allowed to be used to poll / vote in RMC / RTM?
                AndrewDod
                Well, maybe sort of. For example shareholders do not have to accept E-mail as an address for service.

                Questioning of decisions by companies has nothing at all to do with whether everyone has the opportunity to participate. It is rule/law based....
                23-08-2019, 06:33 AM
              • Fire escape
                Paulsen
                The freeholder and their managing agent have neglected the wooden fire escape which now needs major repairs. I have emailed them several times during the past two years including pictures. My flat is a leasehold first floor flat in a converted house where the ground floor flat comes with the freehold....
                22-08-2019, 15:35 PM
              • Reply to Fire escape
                Section20z
                Sounds like your property is lacking H&S & Fire inspections, request managing agent complies with legislation or ask you local authority housing standards department to intervene or the fire brigade. I doubt it can be removed.
                23-08-2019, 06:17 AM
              • Reply to are online surveys allowed to be used to poll / vote in RMC / RTM?
                Section20z
                There's nothing to stop you having online meetings (if not prohibited by your constitution - which is unlikely for an RMC) so you can teleconference on whatsapp or similar.
                You just need to make sure that everyone has the opportunity to participate so decisions can't be questioned subsequentl...
                23-08-2019, 06:10 AM
              • Reply to are online surveys allowed to be used to poll / vote in RMC / RTM?
                eagle2
                Regarding formal meetings of members. you can send out and receive proxy forms by email, as long as the notice of the meeting states that is an option. You should keep a written record of decisions made by members so the proxy forms should be retained so that they may be produced if necessary,
                ...
                23-08-2019, 05:48 AM
              Working...
              X