Ousting failing RTM co

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  • Section20z
    started a topic Ousting failing RTM co

    Ousting failing RTM co

    As a Freeholder of a property (converted listed building 4 flats 1 shop) that I purchased with an RTM Co in place , I am having serious issues with the single director of the RTM which is failing to maintain the property or comply with H&S legislation, he has also refused to allow me to be a member of the company. The other Lessees don't help much as they are all absent landlords happy to pay no service charge while the building disintegrates.
    Advice from the official government supported website (lease-advice) is that a Landlord can apply to FTT to oust a failing RTM using the "appoint a manager" process, but the FTT are telling me only a lessee can apply.
    Anyone had any experience in similar situation or suggestions ??

  • eagle2
    replied
    I do not recommend that you become a director of the RTM Company otherwise you become responsible for its failings. You can take legal action against it but you need to consider the costs involved and whether or not you would recover them.

    Leave a comment:


  • leaseholder64
    replied
    The fee for inspecting is £3.50 an hour. The absolute maximum fee for a copy is £125, but there would have to be 100,000+ members to attract that fee. For most flat management companies it would be £35. The reasonable costs of delivery can be added, but they are not going to be more than £5, in my view.

    The £3.50 fee only applies to non-members.

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2...0072612_en.pdf

    If they consider it vindictive, they only way they can stop you having the information is by obtaining a court order. No normal flat management company is going to succeed in obtaining such an order; they are intended for cases like vivisection companies where there were hate campaigns against members.

    There is basically a strong presumption that this information should be available to the public.

    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    Brief update, as companies house breaches department have written to the RTM about their refusal to provide me with the Register of Members and the director has responded saying I am being vindictive and he will only let me have it if I pay £400.00.
    Just waiting to see if CH put more pressure on him now.
    They have finally issued section 20 for some damp works but I assume it is invalid as a single director is prohibited from authorising any action other than an egm ?
    Originally posted by leaseholder64 View Post
    Even if you are not a member, they must provide you with the list of members. If you are a member, you can inspect it free of charge. If not there is a small charge they can make for inspection. You need to make the request in the right way. They can only refuse by obtaining a court order, which they wouldn't get and the penny pinching lessees wouldn't want to pay for. There is a charge for everyone if you want them to supply copies, but it is not very large, in the scheme of things.

    If you can document an invalid refusal, it would be worth contacting the breaches team at Companies House, to see if they can remind the director of the law.

    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    I don't particularly want "control" , I have no issues with RTMs in principle as often they will do a better job of maintenance than the Freeholder.
    Just not in this case - so if I could apply to appoint a manager I would take that route, sadly I can't.

    Leave a comment:


  • Macromia
    replied
    Originally posted by ram View Post

    The reason to have a Manger appointed, is because
    "the RTM is failing to maintain the property", that is why the RTM has to be removed / changed, etc.

    Getting a manager appointed wouldn't give the freeholder control (unless they can persuade the tribunal to appoint them as the manager, without being too detailed about the way the building has to be managed), but it should mean that any maintenance work that is required gets done, and the leaseholders might then be made to understand that future costs would be lower if there was regular, ongoing maintenance instead of leaving the building to become run down again.

    Leave a comment:


  • ram
    replied
    Originally posted by vmart View Post
    Even if you could apply to appoint a manager I would not recommend this. The route does not give you any control either.
    The reason to have a Manger appointed, is because
    "the RTM is failing to maintain the property", that is why the RTM has to be removed / changed, etc.


    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    Not a bad shout ! I've tried the LA who aren't interested despite letting licences being required in the area .
    My slight reluctance is it's not 100% certain that H&S obligations fall to RTM and it might come back to bite me !! Fire brigade will have no hesitation in closing down the property and I might end up paying hotel bills for the lot of 'em 😕
    Originally posted by leaseholder64 View Post
    If these are flats over commercial premises, the fire brigade may actually be interested in pro-active auditing of fire safety, as such arrangements are considered high risk. Maybe get legal advice, but it does seem to me that the RTM is the one that would get the enforcement notices.

    Leave a comment:


  • leaseholder64
    replied
    If these are flats over commercial premises, the fire brigade may actually be interested in pro-active auditing of fire safety, as such arrangements are considered high risk. Maybe get legal advice, but it does seem to me that the RTM is the one that would get the enforcement notices.

    Leave a comment:


  • desamax
    replied
    Have you taken any advice on all of the above ?

    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    Correct, they had no right to take over the management but sadly that knowledge gets us no nearer to resolving the situation 😐

    Leave a comment:


  • desamax
    replied
    Surely the argument should be they had no rights to form one?
    if my memory serves me they could only have formed an RTA.

    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    Indeed, but there already is an RTM so back to the original question. How do I oust them ?

    Originally posted by desamax View Post
    if the commercial area takes up more than 25% total Floor area...

    below taken from this website
    https://www.bradysolicitors.com/brad...ght-to-manage/



    This is a key criteria for RTM and one that isn’t always easy to assess. If the commercial / residential split isn’t clear, you may need to get expert opinion on the internal floor area.

    When calculating the commercial percentage, an assessor will include any dividing walls to the commercial unit and also any commercial car parking spaces. Balconies however will not be included.

    Whilst the burden of proof rests with the landlord, if he can provide evidence that there is at least 26% commercial tenancy, the RTM will not be possible.

    Leave a comment:


  • desamax
    replied
    if the commercial area takes up more than 25% total Floor area...

    below taken from this website
    https://www.bradysolicitors.com/brad...ght-to-manage/



    This is a key criteria for RTM and one that isn’t always easy to assess. If the commercial / residential split isn’t clear, you may need to get expert opinion on the internal floor area.

    When calculating the commercial percentage, an assessor will include any dividing walls to the commercial unit and also any commercial car parking spaces. Balconies however will not be included.

    Whilst the burden of proof rests with the landlord, if he can provide evidence that there is at least 26% commercial tenancy, the RTM will not be possible.

    Leave a comment:


  • Section20z
    replied
    Thanks, I will contact companies house breaches and see if they will put any pressure on.
    The shop lessee and one other are also concerned about the condition and long term impact so might be persuaded to join me in becoming directors.
    The commercial part is way more than 25%.

    Leave a comment:

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