S20 Application to miss due to time constrains

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    S20 Application to miss due to time constrains

    For some work carried out on my Block the Man Co stated they were going to apply to short circuit the S20 procedure as the works were urgent. As nobody in the Block has any S20 documentation how can I find out if the FTT allowed the S20 to be missed? I have asked but the Man Co doesn't reply to those types of requests.

    #2
    The FTT should invite all the leaseholders to join in the case, so you should have been made aware if the FTT was actually involved. As the FTT process, itself, takes time, they may be doing it in parallel, or may have decided only to do it retrospectively, if challenged.

    The general policy on such cases seems to be that the FTT expects the lessor to do as much consultation as possible, in the time available. Going silent on you seems a good way to lose their case.

    Comment


      #3
      OK, 2013 I have an email stating they were going to withdraw their S20 Dispensation Application for the works as the timescale was too short but no other paperwork. Neither S20 or Dispensation Authority if the Man Co don't reply can I apply to the FTT (LVT as was) and will they tell me if an Application was received or do I have to Lodge a Full Service Charge Review Application (or whatever it is called).

      Works were started 2015 complete later 2015 if that makes a difference.

      Comment


        #4
        I don't know for certain, but I suspect only the lessor knows for certain, so the only way that going through an FTT would help is that they this information would be volunteered to them, as part of the defence, if there had been a successful application.

        I think it is quite common that applications to dispense are made retrospectively.

        Why do you think you have lost out? They will win if they can demonstrate that:
        - the job was needed, and was urgent;
        - they made a best effort to consult;
        - the resulting cost to you was as good as you would have expected in the circumstances, on the basis of the best long term outcome.

        You wouldn't get a dispensation authority if they withdrew the application.

        Comment


          #5
          I am a bit perplexed. If they can get retrospective S20 why bother at all? If they can show they intended to get the best quote and didn't bother just picked a name out of the hat as it were, they would provide a number of higher quotes to justify not getting the "cheapest". Whereas the Tenants havn't been offered the opportunity to show a cheaper/ better alternative. How can the FTT know if the actual firm doing the Works is not somehow linked to the Man Co?

          The job was needed and was urgent, it was fire protection that should have been installed when the building was first built but wasn't (10 years or so). It was so urgent the Man Co decided to apply for a dispensation from the S20 in 2012 and then again to not apply for the dispensation in 2013 and finally get round to doing the job in 2015. Which part of the Man Cos action showed urgency? They made no effort at all to consult other than a reply to my email asking if they received the Dispensation.

          Apologies for the rant.

          Comment


            #6
            It is the dispensation that is retrospective. Full dispensation is only possible if there was a real emergency. Otherwise they may get a dispensation based on evidence of what price might have been achieved if there had been a full consultation. Originally there was only the first option, but then there was Daejan v Benson case: https://www.lease-advice.org/article...o-freeholders/

            Comment


              #7
              Actually I'm interested in your particular reason for urgency. My feeling would be that it would be difficult to argue that dispensation was needed given when the fire risk assessment should have been done. Even then the Daejan case might apply.

              I would only challenge it if you are certain you overpaid as a result of the consultation failure.

              Comment


                #8
                " I have asked but the Man Co doesn't reply to those types of requests."

                I had one like that, start every conversation with a request to make a formal complaint.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Forgetting the dispensation part, did you get the 2 or 3 stage S20 notification that the works needed to be done, and the 2nd stage saying who the quotes were from, and how much the works would cost ?

                  Comment

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