Freeholder banged up abroad

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  • pilman
    replied
    No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court.
    That restriction does not apply if both you and your wife sign the transfer deed and include the statement that the new named couple will own 50% share as tenants in common with the other named person "Mr. A" who will continue to own 50% share in the freehold.
    Two people signing the TR1 act as trustees, so that the restriction is not applicable, especially as the trustees are ensuring that the legal entitlement of Mr. A to his 50% share as tenant in common is secured by the wording used in the deed.

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  • Gordon999
    replied
    If the joint owner is in overseas prison and you need another signature, I suggest you apply to the local Magistrates Court.

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  • pebblepebble
    replied
    Originally posted by Gordon999 View Post
    You should make an appointment with Land Registry Office to sort out your problem.
    Land Registry aren't making appointments at the moment, questions are being answered by email. It's really not the same as talking to someone either on the phone or in front of you. They didn't answer my question but referred me to their website. Strangely the reason I contacted them was because the answer to my question wasn't on there.

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  • Gordon999
    replied
    You should make an appointment with Land Registry Office to sort out your problem.

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  • sealed1
    replied
    I found this in Practice Guide 24. I don't know if this would apply:
    If the disposition creating the trust requires the consent of more than two persons to a disposition and it is not possible to obtain the consent of all of them, but two of the necessary consents can be provided, this is sufficient in favour of a purchaser (section 10(1) of the Trusts of Land and Appointment of Trustees Act 1996).

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  • sealed1
    replied
    Originally posted by pilman View Post
    The share of a tenancy in common can be disposed of in a will, so there appears to be no reason why the half share in the freehold cannot be transferred if that was the share shown on the deed of trust created when the named parties were entered as proprietors of the freehold title.

    The transfer may require a TP1 form because it is a transfer of part of the registered title.
    i.e. The appropriate share owned by you and your wife, which is what will be transferred.

    Like the other poster I would also wait to see if Lawcruncher offers the high quality of legal advice as he so often does on this web-site.
    That's interesting. Another thing I've noticed is that when the TR1 was entered when we were transferees, it stated that the three of us were 'to hold the property on trust for themselves as tenants in common in equal shares' - It was also marked as 'not for money'.

    The TR1 form for the new transferees, including Mr A is states 'they are to hold the property on trust as tenants in common with 50% for the two people we were transferring the leasehold to, and 50% for Mr A.'

    I don't know if this helps anyone who might want to help.

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  • pilman
    replied
    The share of a tenancy in common can be disposed of in a will, so there appears to be no reason why the half share in the freehold cannot be transferred if that was the share shown on the deed of trust created when the named parties were entered as proprietors of the freehold title.

    The transfer may require a TP1 form because it is a transfer of part of the registered title.
    i.e. The appropriate share owned by you and your wife, which is what will be transferred.

    Like the other poster I would also wait to see if Lawcruncher offers the high quality of legal advice as he so often does on this web-site.

    Leave a comment:


  • sealed1
    replied
    Also, if I was really stuck here, would being tenants in common like this be the same as owning it is a trust - could possibly arrange a section 25 power of attorney under the Trustee Act 1925 if so. The issue I fear is that he might not want to reveal a TR1 in a foreign prison that shows he owns a property/freehold abroad but might be willing to sign a power of attorney.

    Leave a comment:


  • sealed1
    replied
    Originally posted by flyingfreehold View Post
    Clearly the freehold is of nominal value only, presumably you have a 999 year lease at a peppercorn. If the best you can do is supply a transfer signed by the two of you, and the buyer can wait to see if the third proprietor resurfaces. I think each proprietor ought to sign but I would be interested to have the view of Lawcruncher who may have some interesting pearls to cast
    The lease is about 160 years with no ground rent - it has the value of the property that we bought it for 5 years ago.

    The freehold is currently being transferred for £1. If this was changed to nothing of monetary value would this help?

    Thanks - I'll await Lawcruncher then with baited breath, hoping there is some technicality that someone might get a result.

    Leave a comment:


  • flyingfreehold
    replied
    Clearly the freehold is of nominal value only, presumably you have a 999 year lease at a peppercorn. If the best you can do is supply a transfer signed by the two of you, and the buyer can wait to see if the third proprietor resurfaces. I think each proprietor ought to sign but I would be interested to have the view of Lawcruncher who may have some interesting pearls to cast

    Leave a comment:


  • sealed1
    started a topic Freeholder banged up abroad

    Freeholder banged up abroad

    My wife and I own the freehold (we are both named on the title) of our building with Mr A. Mr A is in prison abroad and possibly won't be willing to sign documents in prison. He own the lease of the one other flat in the building.

    We are selling our flat (with the value on the leasehold) and have agreed to transfer freehold too (the title shows we paid £130 for this in 2015).

    To transfer the freehold to the new owners, keeping Mr A on the title, do we need his signature?
    Or are the signatures of my wife and I sufficient for the TR1?

    The title contains the restriction: No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court.

    The freehold refers to us as 'Proprietor'.

    I understand that in some circumstances two of the proprietors can sign but I don't know when exactly.

    Thank you,

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